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Period handbook

Posted: Sat Feb 22, 2020 10:14 am
by geoberni
Hi All
This week I purchased a period owners handbook for my late SII. I think is about a year younger than the car, but close enough.
I was very surprised to find the Controls illustration illustrate a Radio Speaker in front of the Driver.
I have never seen a Moggie with one fitted there?
Has anyone actually got a car with this layout?
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Another little 'quirk' of this illustration is that it presumably illustrates a RHD car, since the indicator switch is shown on the RH side, yet the Speedo Dial says 'Flashing Indicator Warning Light -L.H.D,'

Re: Period handbook

Posted: Sat Feb 22, 2020 11:04 am
by les
Maybe only functioning for Lhd cars. I don’t know much about early Minors but perhaps exports have flashing indicators as apposed to semaphore type, which i thought had the warning lamp on the direction lever. I’m only guessing here!

Re: Period handbook

Posted: Sat Feb 22, 2020 12:13 pm
by geoberni
les wrote:
Sat Feb 22, 2020 11:04 am
Maybe only functioning for Lhd cars. I don’t know much about early Minors but perhaps exports have flashing indicators as apposed to semaphore type, which i thought had the warning lamp on the direction lever. I’m only guessing here!
Basil has a latter Lucas type Indicator switch, rather than the old pneumatic timer sort, so I too don't have that knowledge.
Even the manual doesn't help
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How would you see a lamp that presumably pointed down at the floor, and what did the early 4 door have for a warning? No lamp at all?

Re: Period handbook

Posted: Sat Feb 22, 2020 5:58 pm
by myoldjalopy
I guess the same as Les about the LHD indicator light for exports - someone else may know for sure. But the switch light for 2-doors/convertibles certainly didn't point towards the floor! They were mounted on a bracket to the right and below the dash (your manual illustration shows it shows it - 'direction indicator switch - hand cancelling'). 4-doors didn't need a warning light as they were self-cancelling 8)

Re: Period handbook

Posted: Sat Feb 22, 2020 6:24 pm
by stevey
Yes on Facelift modles, the indicator warning light was only wired up on export cars with flashing indicators. Homemaket had trafficators and so the warning light was not needed and not wired up, as on 4 door and traveller models teh trafficators could be seen to be working, on 2 door and convertible that typr of trafficator switch had a warning light built into it.

Re: Period handbook

Posted: Sun Feb 23, 2020 9:49 am
by myoldjalopy
Thanks for confirming the point about export cars, Stevey, although I believe the lack of a warning light on home market 4-doors and travellers is less to do with actually being able to see the trafficator (you do have to turn your head) and more to do with them being self-cancelling.....a bit like how you can leave a kettle that switches itself off when it reaches boiling point without risking it boiling dry.

Re: Period handbook

Posted: Wed Feb 26, 2020 7:49 pm
by jagnut66
Hi,
I have now managed to get hold of a Fifth Edition handbook for my 1954 car and I'm really chuffed with it, a real period piece. I've attached a sample below for anyone interested, I shall be giving it a read through to see what they were prescribing back in the day.....
Morris Minor Operation Manual Fifth Edition 1.JPG
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Morris Minor Operation Manual Fifth Edition 2.JPG
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Morris Minor Operation Manual Fifth Edition 3.JPG
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Morris Minor Operation Manual Fifth Edition 4.JPG
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I love the image of the chap washing his car, it looks more like a favourite family pet even back then. Perhaps he took it for 'walkies' after......
Morris Minor Operation Manual Fifth Edition 5.JPG
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The instruments and controls section is different from Geobernies though, so I can't do a comparison with my manual on that, no mention of a radio in mine at all, that I can see.
Best wishes,
Mike.

Re: Period handbook

Posted: Wed Feb 26, 2020 7:51 pm
by jagnut66
PS: I also really like the pull out lubrication chart at the end, did they all have this?
Morris Minor Operation Manual Fifth Edition 6.JPG
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Re: Period handbook

Posted: Thu Feb 27, 2020 3:42 am
by SriVik
geoberni wrote:
Sat Feb 22, 2020 10:14 am
Hi All
This week I purchased a period owners handbook for my late SII. I think is about a year younger than the car, but close enough.
I was very surprised to find the Controls illustration illustrate a Radio Speaker in front of the Driver.
I have never seen a Moggie with one fitted there?
Has anyone actually got a car with this layout?
IMG.jpg

Another little 'quirk' of this illustration is that it presumably illustrates a RHD car, since the indicator switch is shown on the RH side, yet the Speedo Dial says 'Flashing Indicator Warning Light -L.H.D,'
Hai may inkniw which edition is this book? Or usually it does have a code like AKD 3922 B or C or D ...

Re: Period handbook

Posted: Thu Feb 27, 2020 7:37 am
by woodiesenfrance
Jagnut66 - all of our copies various, in English and in French from MM through to 1000 have the lubrication chart.
SriVik, some of ours have the edition n° on the front cover, in some you find a date eg 11/54 printed in small characters on one of the pages at the back.
Our French 1st edition 1000 manual is marked AKD 799 top right of front cover.

Re: Period handbook

Posted: Thu Feb 27, 2020 9:09 am
by jagnut66
Jagnut66 - all of our copies various, in English and in French from MM through to 1000 have the lubrication chart.
SriVik, some of ours have the edition n° on the front cover, in some you find a date eg 11/54 printed in small characters on one of the pages at the back.
Our French 1st edition 1000 manual is marked AKD 799 top right of front cover.
Thanks, when I read through the book I'll look out for that date.

Regarding issue numbers, mine is the 5th edition, the earlier editions seemed to be for the MM (lowlight) model, which means Berni's must be a 6th or 7th edition, as I believe the 8th and 9th were for the Minor 1000.
Is this correct Berni?
Best wishes,
Mike.

Re: Period handbook

Posted: Thu Feb 27, 2020 9:25 am
by myoldjalopy
'geoberni' can confirm what edition his is, but it won't be a 6th addition as that is for the SII 'facelift' models and the illustrations look like yours Mike - except, of course, the dash is different

Re: Period handbook

Posted: Thu Feb 27, 2020 11:05 am
by ianmack
We can pool our handbook info and hopefully build up a picture of what was issued and when. I have picked up the following copies over the years:

Series MM with no edition number but a print date of 2/59 on page 63 so presumably a replacement copy. Marked AKD470J.

Series 2 fifth edition, printed 2/54 on page79.

Series 2 ninth edition, printed 4/56 on page 63. AKD617.

1000 with no edition number but printed 6/58 on page 63.AKD680D.

1000 17th edition printed 1970 on flyleaf. AKD3922.

One question that springs to mind is did they start again with a first edition for the 1000? Alternatively they may have had more than one edition a year in the early days when there were more changes and fewer in the late sixties when things stayed the same.

All my copies have the lubrication chart but in the 1000 books they don’t fold out.

Re: Period handbook

Posted: Thu Feb 27, 2020 11:21 am
by geoberni
Hi All
The one I have brought is a Ninth Edition, so that ruins Mike's supposition regarding early 1000 manuals. It's the same as the one Ianmack has presumably.
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The footnote on the last Index page includes the numbers 4/56 which I am assuming could be the date of the booklet. Though what the 29/66 indicates is anyone's guess. it's clearly a late SII booklet.
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Some of the illustrations have changed from Mike's 5th Ed. I don't have an illustration of a car in a garage to go with the Bodywork remarks
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But I do love the fact they they redrew the gearstick for LHD and RHD cars. :lol: :roll:
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Re: Period handbook

Posted: Thu Feb 27, 2020 1:50 pm
by woodiesenfrance
As it's wet and cool here your posts prompted me to do a bit of ebaying which I haven't done for ages, and with good results: two French language Morris Minor brochures which we haven't seen before purchased for our Club archives.

Ianmack, if you want to note these down we have copies of:
Operation Manuals in English:
Series II Fifth Edition, dated 2/54 on page 79
Series II Seventh Edition, dated 4/55 on page 63

I'm sure we have some English 1000 manuals somewhere, can't see them just now.

Manuel d'Entretien in French :
Serie MM, printed in Brussels and issued by the Importers Ets P Decrose S.A.
No date anywhere, has a tables at the front of the general characteristics of both 918 sidevalve and later overhead 803 engines.

Serie II, printed by Nuffield, dated 11/54 (two copies)

Morris Minor 1000, 1st edition ref AKD799 dated 3/58 on page 63. Published by Morris Motors Limited for export by Nuffield Exports Limited
Plus just a photocopy of the 1964 modifications update, ref AKD 3054C/1 (French)

We also have a very rare full workshop manual in French for MM through to 948. Some of the illustrations are line drawings, others are black and white photos. Found it at an autojumble ages ago, paid for it in French Francs.

Re: Period handbook

Posted: Thu Feb 27, 2020 2:56 pm
by jagnut66
Hi,
I just had a further delve into the realms of operation manuals and from what I can see the Fourth Edition covers 'Highlight' MM's.
However I am now less confident of what I said earlier, it seems there are more 'editions' than my first searches led me to believe.
Perhaps someone on here has a definitive collection and can shed more light on it...…
Best wishes,
Mike.

Re: Period handbook

Posted: Thu Feb 27, 2020 7:18 pm
by noidea
hi all just to put a spanner in the works i have just looked at mine
it says morris minor series 11 operation manual second edition if this means any thing

dave

Re: Period handbook

Posted: Thu Feb 27, 2020 8:44 pm
by geoberni
noidea wrote:
Thu Feb 27, 2020 7:18 pm
hi all just to put a spanner in the works i have just looked at mine
it says morris minor series 11 operation manual second edition if this means any thing

dave
Dave
Take a look at the last page of the Index at the back. The small print footnote will likely have a date as per my example above. I suspect you've got one from late '52 or early '53.

Re: Period handbook

Posted: Thu Feb 27, 2020 8:59 pm
by noidea
hi mine is 2/53
it also has the page with the car reg and bought date
dave

Re: Period handbook

Posted: Fri Feb 28, 2020 8:10 am
by ianmack
A second edition for the series two in 1953 to a ninth in 1956 is quite a progression. I had no idea they were so prolific. This would seem to confirm my view that they started with a first edition for each series. There must have been more than one edition for the MM if only to cover variations in headlight adjustment.

Clearly there are a lot of gaps to fill if owners are to identify the appropriate book for their car.