Member - Non Member Field

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philthehill
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Member - Non Member Field

Post by philthehill »

If the member - non member information is not kept up to date there is absolutely no need for the line entry.

Incorrect information is worse than no information.

Phil

Murrayminor
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Re: STATEMENT BY THE DIRECTORS OF THE MMOC ON THE COVID-19/CORONA VIRUS PANDEMIC

Post by Murrayminor »

philthehill wrote: Tue May 05, 2020 9:49 am If the member - non member information is not kept up to date there is absolutely no need for the line entry.

Incorrect information is worse than no information.

Phil
It does seem a bit daft being able to opt in or out, surely a paid up member should automatically be listed as such and the same for non members.
The self enrolment system is open to abuse, I use that as a guide when dealing with other when buying parts as a fall back should things go awry, now I think I will be wary from now on.
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Re: STATEMENT BY THE DIRECTORS OF THE MMOC ON THE COVID-19/CORONA VIRUS PANDEMIC

Post by Admin »

No, that's not how it works.

It is wholly unrealistic for the club to moderate that field and ensure that the answer provided is correct. Apart from the fact that many thousands of usernames on the forum are not peoples real names rendering it impossible for a moderator to correlate forum members to club members, it's perfectly possible that the club member in a household might not be the same person as a forum member, for example, and moderators would have to recheck the data each month to see whether club membership had expired... Sorry, that's not an option. It's provided 'as is' :wink:
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philthehill
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Re: STATEMENT BY THE DIRECTORS OF THE MMOC ON THE COVID-19/CORONA VIRUS PANDEMIC

Post by philthehill »

All I can say is ………... delete the membership option to avoid any further confusion.

Phil

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Re: STATEMENT BY THE DIRECTORS OF THE MMOC ON THE COVID-19/CORONA VIRUS PANDEMIC

Post by Admin »

philthehill wrote: Tue May 05, 2020 10:23 am All I can say is ………... delete the membership option to avoid any further confusion.

Phil
No. Next question, please
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geoberni
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Re: STATEMENT BY THE DIRECTORS OF THE MMOC ON THE COVID-19/CORONA VIRUS PANDEMIC

Post by geoberni »

Quite honestly, the 'MMOC Member' filed is a complete waste of time.
The vast majority of people on the forum don't even know how to alter it (even though Mike has now told them), and what's the point of it when people can pick and choose; there's nothing to stop a non-member changing it to yes.

Mike said
Admin wrote: Tue May 05, 2020 9:00 am It would be safer to assume that everyone who has chosen to change the indicator to 'Yes' is a member than that anyone who shows No isn't, if you follow what I mean. I don't personally like this indicator for just this reason, but a number of members asked for it and so it is here!
Quite honestly, IMHO, those asking for it should have been told how pointless it was and the request denied.

This actually opens up a far wider and probably controversial discussion...

Perhaps the Club should decide if the Forum is open to anyone to join or for members only.
For example, how are club funds allocated or ring-fenced?
Is the cost of the Forum, and the hopefully impending upgrade/updating just taken from the general money pot or is a specific stream allocated?
It is ultimately the club money that is funding the Forums, so is there a benefit to members in having it open to all?
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Re: STATEMENT BY THE DIRECTORS OF THE MMOC ON THE COVID-19/CORONA VIRUS PANDEMIC

Post by Murrayminor »

Admin wrote: Tue May 05, 2020 10:28 am
philthehill wrote: Tue May 05, 2020 10:23 am All I can say is ………... delete the membership option to avoid any further confusion.

Phil
No. Next question, please
Begs the question, Why not?
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Murrayminor
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Re: Member - Non Member Field

Post by Murrayminor »

As I mentioned before, I am a paid up member and shown as such, If I was unscrupulous I "could" create numerous false accounts, begin my post count and then advertise desirable parts for sale, then take the money and run.

Whereas if the forum was for paid up members only or had a members only section then people would know who they were dealing with, not only when it comes to buying spares etc but general security.

I feel the current system is open to abuse.
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Re: STATEMENT BY THE DIRECTORS OF THE MMOC ON THE COVID-19/CORONA VIRUS PANDEMIC

Post by Admin »

Murrayminor wrote: Tue May 05, 2020 10:37 am
Admin wrote: Tue May 05, 2020 10:28 am
philthehill wrote: Tue May 05, 2020 10:23 am All I can say is ………... delete the membership option to avoid any further confusion.

Phil
No. Next question, please
Begs the question, Why not?
Because:
When the question first arose, a forum member - who may or may not have been a club member as well - said the facility should be available. A number of other forum members - who may or may not have been club members as well - agreed and a couple of threads on the issue arrived. All of the very valid objections as to why it wasn't a great concept were raised, but unfortunately our resident malcontents had found the topic and were loudly proclaiming that the club wasn't listening to it's members wants (happily ignoring that they might not have actually been members) and complaints were made. As a result, the facility was introduced, subject to the caveats in my earlier post, the main one being that it had and could have no integrity and so was actually just an optional 'badge of honour'.
It's been in use for a fair period of time now with no fanfare, but following someone mistakenly - or maybe not, as the poster hasn't chosen to reveal his membership status - believing the field to be a true indicator of non-membership, someone wants it removed. Here, then, is a perfect encapsulation of 'damned if you do, damned if you don't'. A number of posters are very vocal that they want it, and others that they don't. So whichever way we go, I'm going to upset someone. Having endured the annoyance of initiating the flipping thing against my then wishes, I'm not now minded to remove it, so it's the 'take it down'ers who I've chosen to annoy today. Soz to them :)
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ianmack
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Re: Member - Non Member Field

Post by ianmack »

If anyone seriously wanted to set up an on line fraud there are plenty of more lucrative possibilities than pretending to sell Morris Minor bits :evil: .
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Re: Member - Non Member Field

Post by Murrayminor »

ianmack wrote: Tue May 05, 2020 11:02 am If anyone seriously wanted to set up an on line fraud there are plenty of more lucrative possibilities than pretending to sell Morris Minor bits :evil: .
Indeed I would imagine there are more lucrative ways to make money, but gaining a couple of hundred pounds from one transaction is not bad is it, I was using that scenario as an example.

I wonder could a line be placed on the index page to highlight the forum is open to everyone rather than just members or is that too much work? I'm not very I.T. Savvy
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Re: Member - Non Member Field

Post by philthehill »

I see from above this has metamorphized into a new thread.
You will need to try harder to annoy me. :D
Phil

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Re: Member - Non Member Field

Post by Des911 »

Not only that, Phil, but you're now credited with starting this thread making you out to be a trouble causer
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philthehill
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Re: Member - Non Member Field

Post by philthehill »

:D

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Re: Member - Non Member Field

Post by Myrtles Man »

Perhaps the category should be changed to MMOC Member: No/Might Be 8)
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Re: Member - Non Member Field

Post by Admin »

Murrayminor wrote: Tue May 05, 2020 10:53 am ...or had a members only section then people would know who they were dealing with...
I'd love a members only sectionn, but the issue falls to managing it. Every time a new application arrived I'd have to trawl through the members database and check they were a club member. But that's the easy bit. Then I'd have to recheck, every day or couple of days or week or whatever, that they were still club members, and delete any that hadn't renewed. What would I do with posts that were made by members that were members when they made them but are now not members? Delete them? What, all the way back through time, regardless of whether they were 'material' in a thread or something? Rename them 'anonymous poster'? Okay, what when that now ex-member renews and becomes a member again and wants to 'reclaim' his posts? If it could be automated, some of the issues would be easier to manage, but remember we're running an ancient version of a bulletin board that had no inkling of the Year 2000 bug, let alone the Coronavirus.
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Re: Member - Non Member Field

Post by Des911 »

How about telling your members of staff or moderators to change their field to "yes". I don't know how many you have but the first 2 are still non members.
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Re: Member - Non Member Field

Post by Murrayminor »

Admin wrote: Tue May 05, 2020 12:18 pm
Murrayminor wrote: Tue May 05, 2020 10:53 am ...or had a members only section then people would know who they were dealing with...
I'd love a members only sectionn, but the issue falls to managing it. Every time a new application arrived I'd have to trawl through the members database and check they were a club member. But that's the easy bit. Then I'd have to recheck, every day or couple of days or week or whatever, that they were still club members, and delete any that hadn't renewed. What would I do with posts that were made by members that were members when they made them but are now not members? Delete them? What, all the way back through time, regardless of whether they were 'material' in a thread or something? Rename them 'anonymous poster'? Okay, what when that now ex-member renews and becomes a member again and wants to 'reclaim' his posts? If it could be automated, some of the issues would be easier to manage, but remember we're running an ancient version of a bulletin board that had no inkling of the Year 2000 bug, let alone the Coronavirus.
Thanks for the update and explanation, its definitely not an easy job, Thanks for the work you and everyone else puts in it is appreciated but these questions have to be asked.

I have nothing more to say on this subject and understand the situation more clearly now.

Cheers

Dermot.
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Re: Member - Non Member Field

Post by KeithL »

I think it is useful to have the field, but it's of questionable value if the data is wrong. I suspect a lot of forum members don't even know it is there or how to change it. I only found out when this topic came up previously on the forum - I cannot ever remember being told by the Club. Is there a case for the Club e-mailing all Club Members reminding them and telling them how to change it, or perhaps putting it in the magazine?

I know the MX5 Owners Club sets this field based on their membership records. Users cannot change it. How they link the membership to the forum and get round the issue of user names etc. I don't know.

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