Coil Location - when did it change (& why?)

[geoberni]

Hi All
So, Basil has at some point been given a replacement for his 803cc engine and the coil is now mounted above the Dynamo.

There has been plenty of discussion in the forum in the past about Coil positioning (but usually as a tangent to some other topic), the relative merits or 'modern' v 'original' coils, etc including this topic for example viewtopic.php?f=11&t=50738&hilit=coil+location#p481193

Basil still has a couple of holes in the bulkhead where his original coil was about 45 deg towards the engine, presumably inverted.

Note: the eagle-eyed amongst you might notice that the loom does not run down through the clip, which has instead been used for a heater hose. If you look further, you see it can't be correctly routed because whoever fitted it took it that far across to connect the dip switch wiring. I'm assuming the person fitting it was the problem, and not that the new loom had come with tails that were far too short. That's a problem for another rainy afternoon...

DSCF8107-1.jpg (328.38 KiB) Viewed 1653 times

Although he has a re-loom providing the relevant wiring down by the Dynamo, I'm tempted to restore him to a bulkhead coil location.
Part of my reasoning being that my only coil problems came about from a broken joint in the coil (the Accuspark in the photo I've used above), likely to have been caused/exacerbated by the higher frequency vibration of the engine mounting compared to the bulkhead. viewtopic.php?f=11&t=69837&hilit=accusp ... 20#p636467

So, the multipart question.....

Was there a point where the Coil was 'factory fit' on a bracket above the Dynamo?
Did it happen with a particular engine?
Was there a practical engineering reason ......
or was it simply part of production method improvements with the change from SeriesII to 1000 body?

Supplementary question; why do some cars have the coil mounted vertical on the inner wing?

[myoldjalopy]

I can't answer most of your questions, but the coil was apparently moved from the bulkhead to on top of the dynamo during SII production, in May 1955. My car is Jan 1955 and has the coil on the bulkhead.
I don't know whether the coil on the dynamo is more prone to problems, although I did, many years ago, suffer sudden sudden engine failure whilst on a motorway in a 1098 cc traveller. A quick look under the bonnet showed the coil had slipped out of its retaining bracket on top the coil and one of the terminals had shorted out on the dynamo body. I put the coil back, tightened the fixing and away again........maybe engine vibration had eventually loosened the clamp fixings?
There's no reason why fitting a bigger engine means you have to go down the 'coil-on-dynamo' route - I have a 949 fitted in place of the 803 engine but left the coil where it was on the bulkhead. It would appear that whoever re-wired 'Basil' used a later loom requiring the coil to be fitted on the dynamo.

[philthehill]

To help relieve any vibration of the coil when mounted on the dynamo a supplementary steady mount was fitted under the coil but on top of the dynamo coil mounting bracket. The supplementary steady mount supported the coil at the front and rear.

https://www.moss-europe.co.uk/steady-pl ... soc=136904

The supplementary steady was fitted to both 948cc/1098cc cars from chassis number: 338930.

[geoberni]

I can't answer most of your questions, but the coil was apparently moved from the bulkhead to on top of the dynamo during SII production, in May 1955. My car is Jan 1955 and has the coil on the bulkhead.

Thanks. That actually answers quite a bit; it's not linked to a particular engine size or even the model change from SII to 1000.
I wonder if it might have been a small production change to make the assembly a little faster. A fully dressed and tested engine could be dropped into place.

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[geoberni]

To help relieve any vibration of the coil when mounted on the dynamo a supplementary steady mount was fitted under the coil but on top of the dynamo coil mounting bracket. The supplementary steady mount supported the dynamo at the front and rear.

https://www.moss-europe.co.uk/steady-pl ... soc=136904

The supplementary steady was fitted to both 948cc/1098cc cars from chassis number: 338930.

No surprise I don't have one of those fitted then.......
I assume you meant to say "The supplementary steady mount supported the Coil at the front and rear."

Thumbs1.jpg (11.91 KiB) Viewed 1631 times

[philthehill]

Well spotted I am glad someone is on the ball.

The coil mounting bracket Pt No: 1G2620 was fitted also from chassis number: 338930.

For many years I have had either the Lucas sports coil or Lumenition coil mounted on the inside of the O/S wheel arch even when a dynamo was fitted as both coils are a lot heavier than the standard Minor Lucas item.

[jagnut66]

Note: the eagle-eyed amongst you might notice that the loom does not run down through the clip, which has instead been used for a heater hose. If you look further, you see it can't be correctly routed because whoever fitted it took it that far across to connect the dip switch wiring.

Hi,
There is a separate piece of loom, that connects to and then branches off from the main loom and connects to the dip switch on the floor.
This doesn't seem to be supplied with remanufactured looms (neither is the separate wiring for the trafficators).
ESM seem to be the only ones who supply a remanufactured loom section for the dip switch. Quite reasonably priced too, if you wish to correct your wiring. Link below.
NB: The length of the one supplied to me was enough for me to cut it in half and make two dip switch looms from it but don't tell ESM!
You may be lucky too.
Best wishes,
Mike.

https://www.morrisminorspares.com/elect ... ks-p829861

[geoberni]

Mike
thanks for the info. My Dip Switch wires are quite literally only 4" long; that ESM example looks to be some 12"-18", I can understand how you made a spare one! Although it is listed as a LHD one, so presumably should be a bit longer.
Perhaps Basil's last overhaul found the original DS wires were just too short from build to meet the new loom.

I just did a quick search for 'automotive cable' and found that autosparks, of whom ESM are just a reseller for harnesses, offer this one for just £6.24 inc shipping (also available with spade fittings.....)
https://www.autosparks.co.uk/dip-switch ... -foot.html

However, most curiously, if you search their site for a Morris Minor specific lead, they offer quite a few options, of RH/LH drive, PVC or braided cables, pre/post 1958 (which seems to be Fork/Spade terminal difference)
https://www.autosparks.co.uk/catalogsea ... witch+lead at the sort of price ESM resell for?????

I've got all the relevant end fittings; next autojumble I go to, perhaps I'll see if I can get the right colour wires and make one the right length, otherwise, that £6.24 one looks a good bet.
I occasionally have reason to pass near where autosparks are in Sandiacre, Nottingham, so I could even just collect.

[geoberni]

Well spotted I am glad someone is on the ball.

The coil mounting bracket Pt No: 1G2620 was fitted also from chassis number: 338930.

For many years I have had either the Lucas sports coil or Lumenition coil mounted on the inside of the O/S wheel arch even when a dynamo was fitted as both coils are a lot heavier than the standard Minor Lucas item.

Phil
Every day is a learning day.
Searching for your part number above, I found your previous post here in a topic that I missed earlier this year.... viewtopic.php?f=11&t=69891 where you spoke of the support plate too.

Ebay coincidentally currently have a listing for a dynamo with bracket & coil !! https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/MORRIS-MINOR ... Sw7pZbafIg

Meanwhile, it's no surprise to me that mine is somewhat lacking support..... I am so going to move it back to the bulkhead as soon as I can!
In case anyone spots it, yes, the cable is off the temp sensor, I moved it out of the way for the photo....

20190930_180117.jpg (776.55 KiB) Viewed 1573 times

[jagnut66]

Blimey, now you are spoilt for choice and for less than I paid! Humbug!!......
Thinking about it, I have ended up with two sections of loom, so only £4.24 each (£8.48 total)! The tight git in me is now placated........

I shall have to keep a mental note of Autosparks in Nottingham for future use myself though....

Perhaps Basil's last overhaul found the original DS wires were just too short from build to meet the new loom.

Or perhaps they were just too chopped about / knackered and the installer of your new loom didn't check on the availability of a replacement.
My original dip switch section was covered / soaked in oil and crud from 60 odd years of service, so it was in need of replacement. That section of loom (and the terminal end of the dip switch itself for that matter) is a bit exposed to all sorts off the back end of the engine etc.
Best wishes,
Mike.

[jagnut66]

In case you need it when you move that coil:

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/BLACK-20-INC ... 2749.l2649

I have put mine back on the bulkhead but the original coil lead was too short to reach.
Best wishes,
Mike.

[geoberni]

Cheers Mike
I think mine will reach, if not I have spare HT lead