Edd's 1098 engine rebuild.

Let us all know what you are up to with your current restoration project. Get that Minor on the road!
laneychief
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Re: Edd's 1098 engine rebuild.

Postby laneychief » Thu Nov 19, 2015 8:01 pm

Today I removed the cylinder head studs from the block using the two nuts method and a squirt of penetrating fluid (thanks for the tip Bob!)

I also removed the oil filter assembly studs, the oil pressure relief valve, the water drain plug and the oil pressure switch (which bit me when it finally loosened taking half a knuckle with it...)[frame]Image[/frame][frame]Image[/frame]


Finally looking better!

Can anyone tell me what this is and how do I take it off![frame]Image[/frame]


Until next time! What else do I need to remove to take it to the machine shop? Also, if anybody has a valve Spring compressor for Sale, pm me, rather than spending £20+ on a new one I'd rather give an older one a new home!!

Cheers!
Edd
'If you can meet with Triumph and Disaster
And treat those two impostors just the same'

Edd, 26, Devon.

jaekl
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Re: Edd's 1098 engine rebuild.

Postby jaekl » Fri Nov 20, 2015 12:17 pm

Most people do not remove it. It's part of the rear oil seal and it needs to be located very precisely with a small, even clearance to the crankshaft.

laneychief
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Re: Edd's 1098 engine rebuild.

Postby laneychief » Fri Nov 20, 2015 1:25 pm

Oh ok! That's fine with me, I will leave it there then!

Almost ready then, cylinder head once I've got my spring compressor.

Thanks again!
'If you can meet with Triumph and Disaster
And treat those two impostors just the same'

Edd, 26, Devon.

laneychief
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Re: Edd's 1098 engine rebuild.

Postby laneychief » Fri Nov 27, 2015 4:47 pm

Valves out, thanks to aupickup for the compressor! manifold and thermostat studs removed. That's all I can do now, machine shop is next and not enough funds for that![frame]Image[/frame][frame]Image[/frame][frame]Image[/frame]
'If you can meet with Triumph and Disaster
And treat those two impostors just the same'

Edd, 26, Devon.

laneychief
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Re: Edd's 1098 engine rebuild.

Postby laneychief » Sat Dec 19, 2015 3:15 pm

I had a gent from a local classic car company pop up to have a look at the wear on the engine for me. He showed me the markings on the big end bearings and on the block and pistons that say its standard and has never had a grind or rebore. Having had nothing touched on it, his opinion was that it was quite high mileage and his opinion was:
Crank regrind, new big end bearings.
Cam followers shot
Cam lobes out of shape
Rocker assembly full of play
Re bore and pistons
potential block face grind
all the associated bearings with it.

and I want a hardened head for unleaded (As I said before, I'm planning on doing Lands end to John o groats and back coast to coast with this car so hardened is a must for me).

I phoned the machine shop and got some quotes from him for the work and then I set to doing a spreadsheet with a list of parts I'd need and prices of them all to get a total price. The total I hit for the complete rebuild was £772. Plus a bit more here and there for missing studs and nuts and bits.

That came as a slight shock to me I must admit.

My wife had the suggestion of me buying the parts bit by bit throughout the year and save up for the bigger parts and jobs e.g. machine work and pistons and such.

The only thing with that is this will be put on hold for some time then, so I'd need to inhibit corrosion as best I can obviously leaving the machine work till last so I have all the parts ready to pop him back together again.

I'd love to hear some of your thoughts and comments, but for now this Rebuild thread is coming to a close until I can get some parts, I'll post pictures up of bits when I get them here and there.

Thanks for all the help so far!




[frame]Image[/frame]
'If you can meet with Triumph and Disaster
And treat those two impostors just the same'

Edd, 26, Devon.

johngrigg
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Re: Edd's 1098 engine rebuild.

Postby johngrigg » Sat Dec 19, 2015 10:52 pm

I believe hardened valve seats are an unnecessary waste of money I have no scientific or mechanical basis for this assertion, merely my own observations.
in the mid 80's the family 1960 1000 got a rebuild, which didn't include hardened seats,(leaded was then available) 18yo son armed with a brand new licence, decided to visit his sister in Noosa Heads Queensland the only problem being that we lived in Northern Victoria, making a round trip of about 2000 outback miles, which he and a mate managed without incident. since then the car has been used as a daily driver, using premium unleaded when leaded finished.
My point? During a recent rebuild examination of the head showed no evidence of Valve seat recession, merely a little pitting which 16yo grandson was able to lap out ( I think valve grinding is good for the teenage soul ). Needless to say it didn't get hardened seats this time either Just saying and good luck with the rebuild. Merry Xmas to all John G

Neil MG
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Re: Edd's 1098 engine rebuild.

Postby Neil MG » Sun Dec 20, 2015 10:47 am

Take your time, do it right and do it once!

However, that said, an unleaded head can be fitted at any time in the future and is pretty quick and simple.

So I would suggest getting the short engine done first and getting it back in the car. The less time the car is in bits off the road the better!

You could do the rocker bearings and shaft too, but it will run ok without and that is also an assembly that is very quick to remove and refit. It would be ok to use for the very short term. I would just lap the valves and seats and rebuild the head as is. Lowest cost back on the road and no need to pull or strip the engine again.

Personally I agree with John about the hardened valve seats, my Minor and my MG are unmodified and run on standard unleaded. No problems in tens of thousands of miles since leaded disappeared a couple of decades ago. My plan is to change to hardened seats only when they need refacing anyway. My Minor is still on its' original 803cc engine and although used daily, rarely goes over 40 miles in any single run, but the MG is used on long distance motorway journeys.
1956 Morris Minor Series II
1959 MGA 1600 Roadster
1966 Jaguar Mk2 3.8 MOD

laneychief
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Re: Edd's 1098 engine rebuild.

Postby laneychief » Sun Dec 20, 2015 2:02 pm

Ok thank you very much, why are hardened valve seats and valves even a thing then? If everyone says don't bother, where's the science that says it's necessary, I've heard people say you don't need it for small journeys and infrequent use but surely frequent use plus a round Britain trip counts as a long distance and it would be necessary for it. If it isn't for that, why do people even bother?!?!

I'm not rushing to get the engine back in the car, this is a spare I've bought, my car has a working healthy engine in it but it will get swapped out and rebuilt once this is in. The car is dismantled currently anyway awaiting bodywork and a respray so there's no rush there!

So I'd like to do all of these parts slowly and as and when to get this engine as perfect as possible always with the goal of taking it around Britain!

Cheers for the help!
Edd
'If you can meet with Triumph and Disaster
And treat those two impostors just the same'

Edd, 26, Devon.

greendefender123
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Re: Edd's 1098 engine rebuild.

Postby greendefender123 » Sun Dec 20, 2015 2:36 pm

I really wouldn't worry about hardened valves seats. If yours are ok leave well alone. We've always had classic cars and never had any problems. Tho if it will put your mind at rest change them. I think some other car manufacturers might suffer more but these little engines seem to go on. Nobody I know has had problems.

Hope you get your engine sorted and the rest of the car goes smoothly. Sounds a really nice tour of Britain you'd like to do. We're hoping to do similar ourselves. Keep the updates going they really keep me motivated.

Cheers Steve

laneychief
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Re: Edd's 1098 engine rebuild.

Postby laneychief » Sun Dec 20, 2015 2:57 pm

Thanks Steve,

Yeh I'll get the head all cleaned up and decoked and go from there, a picture is being painted that it isn't really necessary though!

Do any of you use lead substitute when refuelling or just don't bother all together?

To be honest, I would be glad to save the money and not get them hardened....

Yeh that's my plan, to do it sponsored for a charity, Blind Children Uk is my plan!

Edd
'If you can meet with Triumph and Disaster
And treat those two impostors just the same'

Edd, 26, Devon.

greendefender123
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Re: Edd's 1098 engine rebuild.

Postby greendefender123 » Sun Dec 20, 2015 3:56 pm

I have used some before but once it ran out i never replaced the bottle. Some people swear by it. But I think some boost the octane or something. I cant see it making much difference to the valve seats.

Oh that should be good then. Hope you raise plenty of money.

laneychief
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Re: Edd's 1098 engine rebuild.

Postby laneychief » Sun Dec 20, 2015 4:10 pm

Ah I see.

Thank you!

Yeh it's slightly long term, next few years, car finished and then hit the road! May try and time it with a central de tour to the national!
'If you can meet with Triumph and Disaster
And treat those two impostors just the same'

Edd, 26, Devon.

Neil MG
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Re: Edd's 1098 engine rebuild.

Postby Neil MG » Sun Dec 20, 2015 4:54 pm

Forget all the additives, save your money. They do not increase octane even if they claim to. There was a study on this published somewhere in one of the magazines, specifically measuring the effects of so called octane boosters. Apart from a couple of very specialist additives none had any significant effect.

As far as lead replacement goes, my opinion is there are little more than a placebo. Lots of people swear by them because they have run their engines without problems for years, using this additive or that. likely they would not have any problems anyway! The money they could have saved over the years could be put towards hardened seats! I like many others have run my engines on standard unleaded without any additive and also had no problems.
1956 Morris Minor Series II
1959 MGA 1600 Roadster
1966 Jaguar Mk2 3.8 MOD

laneychief
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Re: Edd's 1098 engine rebuild.

Postby laneychief » Sun Dec 20, 2015 6:04 pm

Brilliant, ok thank you.

Well that will save me some money, it worked out at about £160 to get it machined and rebuild it myself or £202 to buy an exchange head.

I've got a few bits I can buy now!
'If you can meet with Triumph and Disaster
And treat those two impostors just the same'

Edd, 26, Devon.

laneychief
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Re: Edd's 1098 engine rebuild.

Postby laneychief » Mon Jan 04, 2016 1:45 pm

Could anyone give me a good bit of advice and some guidance on completely cleaning the cylinder head myself with a view to rebuilding and not getting any machine work on it now.


Happy new year all

Edd
'If you can meet with Triumph and Disaster
And treat those two impostors just the same'

Edd, 26, Devon.

Bidz
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Re: Edd's 1098 engine rebuild.

Postby Bidz » Fri Jan 08, 2016 10:57 pm

laneychief wrote:Could anyone give me a good bit of advice and some guidance on completely cleaning the cylinder head myself with a view to rebuilding and not getting any machine work on it now.


Happy new year all

Edd
The latest copy of Minor Matters might be useful!
“The car has become an article of dress without which we feel uncertain, unclad, and incomplete in the urban compound.” ― Marshall McLuhan

panky
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Re: Edd's 1098 engine rebuild.

Postby panky » Fri Jan 08, 2016 11:32 pm

Sneak it into the dishwasher :wink:
Image

TvdWerf
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Re: Edd's 1098 engine rebuild.

Postby TvdWerf » Sun Jan 10, 2016 10:59 am

buy a box with brake cleaner ;)
some old newspapers on the workbench, remove the rough dirt first wit a part of metal or scraper, take an old toothbrush and go with the cleaner.
when you have something under it to keep the used brake cleaner together, it is easier to reuse it.
otherwise you need a big layer from old newspapers :D
MM '51 LHD sidevalve

bmcecosse
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Re: Edd's 1098 engine rebuild.

Postby bmcecosse » Tue Jan 12, 2016 5:02 pm

Frankly - your crank and bores look pretty good to me. A new set of shells and a simple 'glaze bust' of the bores (can be done by hand with some emery paper) and a new set of rings - and I think it will be fine - with a BIG saving in cash. Yes to a new oil pump - the water pump looks fine - and new timing gears/chain (duplex if you want). Show us the cam with the 'worn peaks' - that would be most unusual - and the base of the cam followers.... Probably yes to a new rocker shaft - the rockers are more than likely perfectly ok. Forget the 'unleaded' head - but I think 4 new exhaust valves will be worth having since you are planning a long run - and run them with 15 thou gap and check/reset every 3000 miles. No harm will be done - it will be fine.
ImageImage
Image

laneychief
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Re: Edd's 1098 engine rebuild.

Postby laneychief » Wed Jan 13, 2016 7:48 am

Thanks BMC, that's great advice. I have no idea what I'm looking for in terms of wear so I could do with more opinions really, thank you.

It's on hold slightly, cylinder head going together first but I'm putting my car back into a rolling resto, just rebuilt the carb (need some help with jet centring but will be posting that on my UHU62H resto thread.)


Cheers!

Edd
'If you can meet with Triumph and Disaster
And treat those two impostors just the same'

Edd, 26, Devon.


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