renewing eyebolt bushes?

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MarkyB
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Re: renewing eyebolt bushes?

Postby MarkyB » Tue Jul 05, 2011 9:13 pm

the risks are REAL!
Fatal?

"Once you break something you will see how it was put together"

David53
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Re: renewing eyebolt bushes?

Postby David53 » Wed Jul 06, 2011 6:39 am

Hmmm well, given the amount of tension the arm is under, with the top trunnion slipped free of the damper arm and given that you usually have your head pretty close to the action, if the jack slipped and the swivel suddenly jerked downwards it could flick the whole swivel pin out and smash into your forehead....Perhaps I was being a little dramatic but if it saves someone from breaking even a finger or a wrist then prob worth it.....
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David
Sydney, Australia
1953 Ser II Empire Green

MarkyB
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Re: renewing eyebolt bushes?

Postby MarkyB » Wed Jul 06, 2011 8:27 am

Fair enough, there is plenty of potential energy in the torsion bar until it's unloaded.
People manage to kill themselves with much less dangerous things so I'm sure it is possible.

All I'm saying is that there are other ways to go about the job that aren't in the manual.

"Once you break something you will see how it was put together"

bmcecosse
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Re: renewing eyebolt bushes?

Postby bmcecosse » Wed Jul 06, 2011 9:53 am

Oh dear - probably best to wear a helmet with full face visor then (as the F1 boys do) when working on the car....and chain mail gloves and hearing protection of course.
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ian.mcdougall
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Re: renewing eyebolt bushes?

Postby ian.mcdougall » Wed Jul 06, 2011 3:52 pm

Pardon!!


polo2k
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Re: renewing eyebolt bushes?

Postby polo2k » Wed Jul 06, 2011 7:10 pm

MarkyB wrote:
the risks are REAL!
Fatal?

Hows about we all agree that its something to be wary of. There is a lot of energy contained in the torsion bar and it needs to be dissipated gradually. regardless of the outcome the human body isnt intended to take blows from a torsion bar.


now can we all play nice? and get back to the subject of bushes?
- Ash
  • [MONA] - 1963 4 door saloon
    [IGOR] - 1970 trav (In Surgery)
    [GOLFIE] - 2001 Golf GT TDi 200 (my daily "fix")
- The only way your guarenteed to fail, is never to try! -
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polo2k
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Re: renewing eyebolt bushes?

Postby polo2k » Wed Jul 06, 2011 9:00 pm

And to be constructive, here is a pic of the front suspension off the car:
Image
- Ash
  • [MONA] - 1963 4 door saloon
    [IGOR] - 1970 trav (In Surgery)
    [GOLFIE] - 2001 Golf GT TDi 200 (my daily "fix")
- The only way your guarenteed to fail, is never to try! -
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Click on the middle pic for progress!

chickenjohn
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Re: renewing eyebolt bushes?

Postby chickenjohn » Thu Jul 07, 2011 12:59 am

moggles wrote:BTW, I'd do it differently anyway - in particular I was pretty gobsmacked that you'd remove the eyebolt to change the bushes. In my experience, removing the tight, and usually rusted-in, eyebolt can take an additional 4 times the time spent to dismantle the suspension. Whilst it's good to get it out so you can assess it's, and the chassis rail's, condition, it's not necessary every time the rubber eyebolt bushes are replaced. Removing it also means that you have to perfectly realign it with the torsion bar location pin, to avoid premature 'eating' of the eyebolt bushes - not always so simple.\There's no actual need to remove the eyebolt - once the front of the lower arm is removed, and he back half is set back on it's spline, it is very easy to check and replace the eyebolt bushes, and pin, in situ without removing anymore bits.

The reason for removing the eyebolt is inspection. Often (as with the original poster) when there has been squeaking of the suspension in this area, there has been metal to metal contact- over time this can wear the eyebolt and shackle oval. If this is the case you will need a new eye-bolt and shackle or the ovality will cause the new bushes to wear quickly and back to square one!

In practise, with a squirt of penetrating fluid, and the right size Whitworth socket, the eye bolt retaining nut will come off relatively easily once the rest of the suspension is stripped. The eye bolt can then be easily removed from chassis leg. On assembly the eye-bolt is lined up when the rear half of the wishbone slides over the retaining cup and the torsion bar is loacted properly in the crossmember hole.
Cheers John - all comments IMHO
- Come to this years Kent branches Hop rally! http://www.kenthop.co.uk
(check out the East Kent branch website http://www.ekmm.co.uk )
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chickenjohn
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Re: renewing eyebolt bushes?

Postby chickenjohn » Thu Jul 07, 2011 9:03 am

It's worth remembering that we are working on preserving a classic car here, not a cheap runabout that we are bodging through the MOT each year. So it is most definitely worth going the extra mile when working on an important area of your Minor and make sure everything is in good condition!

chickenjohn
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Re: renewing eyebolt bushes?

Postby chickenjohn » Thu Jul 07, 2011 9:43 am

polo2k wrote:
MarkyB wrote:
the risks are REAL!
Fatal?

Hows about we all agree that its something to be wary of. There is a lot of energy contained in the torsion bar and it needs to be dissipated gradually. regardless of the outcome the human body isnt intended to take blows from a torsion bar.


now can we all play nice? and get back to the subject of bushes?
Exactly Polo, which is why I included jacking up the rear wishbone, withdrawing the bottom trunnion from the wishbone and then gently lowering the torsion bar. Then the torsion bar is not under tension! It is like changing springs/shocks on a McPherson strut equipped car without using spring compressors! Someone on the internet (or down the pub) will always claim they know a quicker way. However, I like to do things the proper way, and certainly this is the proper advice I would give on a public forum!
Cheers John - all comments IMHO
- Come to this years Kent branches Hop rally! http://www.kenthop.co.uk
(check out the East Kent branch website http://www.ekmm.co.uk )
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bmcecosse
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Re: renewing eyebolt bushes?

Postby bmcecosse » Thu Jul 07, 2011 7:43 pm

You need a compressor to change the springs on a strut???? I just wedge them under a bench and hold the spring down with a lever...... :oops:
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Obtuse
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Re: renewing eyebolt bushes?

Postby Obtuse » Thu Jul 07, 2011 8:02 pm

I do *SOOOOOOO* hope that was some kind of a joke...

bmcecosse
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Re: renewing eyebolt bushes?

Postby bmcecosse » Thu Jul 07, 2011 8:11 pm

No -it works - or at least it worked for me when I had to change the front springs on a Fiat Panda a good few years ago. I do have compressors for the slightly heavier springs on my TR7.....
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ian.mcdougall
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Re: renewing eyebolt bushes?

Postby ian.mcdougall » Fri Jul 08, 2011 10:55 am

Years ago someone I knew used a four post lift to change struts until one day one slipped out hit him in the mouth he lost most of his teeth and fractured his jaw :( clamps used after that


MarkyB
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Re: renewing eyebolt bushes?

Postby MarkyB » Fri Jul 08, 2011 8:03 pm

There is a very big difference between using a lever and a four post lift to do a job.

One you have fine control over, the other is a four post lift.

Don't think that spring compressors will always do the job, there are horror stories about using Chinese made spring compressors on Mercedes springs, they fail, and being much heavier cars the springs take a lot more compressing and so hold a lot more potential energy.

You shouldn't go wrong if you follow the book, but it isn't the only way.

"Once you break something you will see how it was put together"

polo2k
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Re: renewing eyebolt bushes?

Postby polo2k » Fri Jul 08, 2011 9:33 pm

bmcecosse wrote:No -it works - or at least it worked for me when I had to change the front springs on a Fiat Panda a good few years ago. I do have compressors for the slightly heavier springs on my TR7.....
bmcecosse wrote:You need a compressor to change the springs on a strut???? I just wedge them under a bench and hold the spring down with a lever...... :oops:
IF ANYONE READS THESE POSTS AND THINKS "ILL TRY THAT DONT!

bmcecosse, This isnt some kind of bragging session where he who defies darwin wins. Think for a second before you post statements like that. What if someone took your advise on a modern car, using significantly stiffer springs.
Just because you got away with it doesnt make it smart.
I wont claim for a second that im an angel and there are many things that I think back on that were daft and stupid (Wrist+torsion bar springs to mind) but I will NEVER advise anyone to do those things.
- Ash
  • [MONA] - 1963 4 door saloon
    [IGOR] - 1970 trav (In Surgery)
    [GOLFIE] - 2001 Golf GT TDi 200 (my daily "fix")
- The only way your guarenteed to fail, is never to try! -
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Click on the middle pic for progress!

bmcecosse
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Re: renewing eyebolt bushes?

Postby bmcecosse » Fri Jul 08, 2011 11:24 pm

It worked for me - and I'm not the one with the broken wrist....... Obviously it's important to understand what you are doing when working on any mechanical repair - I guess you had to learn the hard way with that T bar..... :o
I do say that I have compressors for my TR7 springs - even then - one of them got away from me ! :roll:
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d_harris
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Re: renewing eyebolt bushes?

Postby d_harris » Sat Jul 09, 2011 5:50 pm

I'm not going to advise on method, but its worth doing all the bushes at the same time and with polys a liberal coating of white grease is a very good idea if you don't want squeaks....


bmcecosse
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Re: renewing eyebolt bushes?

Postby bmcecosse » Sat Jul 09, 2011 7:48 pm

Indeed - and don't finally tighten them all up till the weight of the car is on the suspension.
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polo2k
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Re: renewing eyebolt bushes?

Postby polo2k » Sun Jul 10, 2011 7:00 pm

bmcecosse wrote:It worked for me - and I'm not the one with the broken wrist....... Obviously it's important to understand what you are doing when working on any mechanical repair - I guess you had to learn the hard way with that T bar..... :o
I do say that I have compressors for my TR7 springs - even then - one of them got away from me ! :roll:

While im glad it worked for you, I dont want to hear about people taking it as advise.
I did indeed learn the hard way, hopefully im older and wiser these days!
Good to hear that the compressors are in your arsenal, shame they didnt work as well as hoped. :)
- Ash
  • [MONA] - 1963 4 door saloon
    [IGOR] - 1970 trav (In Surgery)
    [GOLFIE] - 2001 Golf GT TDi 200 (my daily "fix")
- The only way your guarenteed to fail, is never to try! -
Image Image Image
Click on the middle pic for progress!


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