Braking bad! (Pun intended)

[surfergirl]

Over the last few years I've replaced everything on the van brakes apart from one pipe under the rad. They are still not very good! New master, drums, flexi pipes, kunifer instead of copper, shoes, back plates yadder yadder.
I've had the van 25 odd years , so I'm used to driving it!
Last thing fitted was a new master cylinder which I had high hopes of improvements, but still no better. I read with interest that some modern drums are machined not quite true and other parts are not what they were.
Rolling down the hill to my fav surf spot this morning , didn't think we would stop at the bottom!

[pde2000]

Same here. I replaced the pipe under the radiator because it rusted through. Fortunately i tested the brakes while parked and the damn thing sprung a leak. I fitted these new drums that judder, but they seem to be getting smoother with use. I should have swapped the backs to front as they hadn't worn so much. The fronts had been running with pennies (centimes) in the cylinders to pack them out. I also use silicone brake fluid.

Last time i got the brakes up to spec i tore an inner tube valve testing them. The valve holes in my rims are bigger diameter than modern ones.

[ManyMinors]

Minor brakes maintained in good condition are fine. There are a lot of cheap, poor quality brake parts on the market and many of the larger suppliers offer a choice. If you have bought new parts, what make of spares did you purchase?
The cheaper brakes shoes, drums, cylinders etc are not going to give you the best braking. It is also important to have the adjustment and bleeding carried out correctly of course .
Does the pedal travel a long way or do the brakes simply not slow the car down?

[surfergirl]

Thanks, most parts are from bullmotif, shoes are Mintex I think, last ones
became unglued from the linings as they don't use rivets anymore!
Brake peddle is good but stopping not so good , feels like the drums aren't true.
Mot next week so rolling road should pick up any faults!

[pde2000]

I just took my own advice and swapped the new front drums for the old back drums, and now theres no judder (it had been getting less anyway).

these are the new drums, showing 3 patches each of brake lining material glazed on;

https://www.mmoc.org.uk/Messageboard/do ... ew&id=1236

https://www.mmoc.org.uk/Messageboard/do ... ew&id=1237

[oliver90owner]

Surfergirl thread,

Can you not lock the wheels on heavy braking? The MoT test may not record a fail even if the brakes will not lock the wheels - I have a Saxo which easily passes its test annually, but making the front tyres 'smoke' on braking is extreeemly difficult. Up side is that the pads will last for years, but my wife would not be able to get the maximum braking effect (but she only drives an automatic these days).

Maybe you need to move the seat forward to get more pedal pressure? Maybe fitting a servo would improve things?

Certainly they should be able to lock the wheels at full pedal pressure. If it feels like the drums need skimming, they likely do. I found that drum brakes needed adjusting very regularly to keep them in tip top trim, so all of the several drum braked cars I owned were changed to discs fairly shortly into my ownership. My Moggie is destined to have discs, so our only car with drums at the front will be the Mini.

[surfergirl]

Thanks,
Cant see why new drums would need skimming, not done that many miles. Why bother selling crap parts when your reputation is at stake and the customer could end up in a ditch.!?

[oliver90owner]

Probably cast one day and turned the next. Might be round but not quite concentric. Bought really cheap by intermediates and reach the market at considerably more mark-up than better quality parts with at least some quality control. If one retailer takes them and offers them at a cut price, everyone wants them. I shall be checking mine very carefully, before fitting, for both roundness and concentricity. Easily fixed, for me.

It's not only brake drums that may be poor quality. Failing brake hydraulic parts are a danger, too. Other carpy parts may not represent as great a safety risk, but they are out there...

[surfergirl]

Mmm

[Smithy1961]

I have found that the critical area is the hub that the drum sits on . having said that all [new] drums these days should be trued up before fitting the same that new shoes should be champfered to fit ..there are no origianal parts anymore to be had so the pattern parts need this extra work .

[philthehill]

Cast/forged parts should have enough time to normalise before being machined.
In the past green (newly cast/forged metal) blocks and other cast/forged parts would be left outside to weather and normalise.