Gearbox woes

Discuss mechanical problems here.

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ndevans
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Re: Gearbox woes

Postby ndevans » Thu Mar 07, 2019 10:41 pm

Ok good folks, next installment in the saga.

The engine is stripped and ready to go for the rebore, so time to get the gearbox out. I've managed to get the gearbox cover off, for the first time ever, or at least since about 1988.

Next question-do I remove the gearbox through the engine bay, or through the passenger compartment?

Cheers N
cheers N
'69 Traveller, 1275, discs.

philthehill
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Re: Gearbox woes

Postby philthehill » Fri Mar 08, 2019 7:33 am

You can remove the gearbox downwards and rearwards and exit under the car.

As you have removed the engine - remove the gearbox forwards into the engine bay and exit the car.


ndevans
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Re: Gearbox woes

Postby ndevans » Fri Mar 08, 2019 10:40 am

Ok thanks. I thought so, looks a pain to go through the passenger compartment! I will take it out through the engine bay, the engine is already out.

On a related note, is it easier to get the engine & gearbox back in as one, or gearbox first, then engine?

Cheers N
cheers N
'69 Traveller, 1275, discs.

oliver90owner
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Re: Gearbox woes

Postby oliver90owner » Fri Mar 08, 2019 11:59 am

ndevans wrote:
Fri Mar 08, 2019 10:40 am

On a related note, is it easier to get the engine & gearbox back in as one, or gearbox first, then engine?

Cheers N
I cannot think of any good reason for not assembling engine to gearbox, “in free air”, before refitting the one unit into the car - unless your lifting tackle is inappropriate.

les
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Re: Gearbox woes

Postby les » Fri Mar 08, 2019 1:55 pm

Whilst it saves the job of clutch shaft alignment, installation of the combined assembly will involve the extra work of dismantling the front radiator panel, with the inherent danger of the threaded trim fixings breaking off, if the front is not already off, think twice about disturbing it.


ndevans
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Re: Gearbox woes

Postby ndevans » Fri Mar 08, 2019 2:19 pm

les wrote:
Fri Mar 08, 2019 1:55 pm
Whilst it saves the job of clutch shaft alignment, installation of the combined assembly will involve the extra work of dismantling the front radiator panel, with the inherent danger of the threaded trim fixings breaking off, if the front is not already off, think twice about disturbing it.
Thanks, good point, but the radiator and front panel are already out!

Cheers N
cheers N
'69 Traveller, 1275, discs.

ndevans
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Re: Gearbox woes

Postby ndevans » Sat Mar 09, 2019 4:45 pm

Nearly there, just got to remove the gearbox cross member, but I need to move the car to get at it properly.

Got to remove the speedo cable-how do I do that? Is it just the aluminium knurled end cap that I remove, or the plastic insert that screws into the gearbox? When I remove the aluminium cap, the cable won't come out.

Cheers N
cheers N
'69 Traveller, 1275, discs.

myoldjalopy
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Re: Gearbox woes

Postby myoldjalopy » Sat Mar 09, 2019 5:18 pm

Once the knurled cap is unscrewed the inner cable *should* just pull out. However, it is not unknown for it to be stuck with dirt/rust etc. Try spraying it with releasing fluid and later try patiently wiggling/pulling on the cable. If that fails, you may have to unscrew the plastic part. Oil may then leak out unless you have already drained the box.

ndevans
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Re: Gearbox woes

Postby ndevans » Sat Mar 09, 2019 6:54 pm

Ok thanks. Haven't changed it since 1990! *Touches wood*
cheers N
'69 Traveller, 1275, discs.

johngrigg
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Re: Gearbox woes

Postby johngrigg » Sat Mar 09, 2019 11:46 pm

With reference to the very helpful moss diagram posted by Phil the Hill where does the pedal return spring, item 40 attach ? It seems to be missing from my 1960 car. The clutch arm spring, item 77 is in place, but isn't strong enough to pull the pedal up against the floor. Cheers John G

ndevans
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Re: Gearbox woes

Postby ndevans » Sun Mar 10, 2019 1:13 pm

johngrigg wrote:
Sat Mar 09, 2019 11:46 pm
With reference to the very helpful moss diagram posted by Phil the Hill where does the pedal return spring, item 40 attach ? It seems to be missing from my 1960 car. The clutch arm spring, item 77 is in place, but isn't strong enough to pull the pedal up against the floor. Cheers John G
The clutch return spring attaches to the engine backplate, there is a hole drilled for it.
cheers N
'69 Traveller, 1275, discs.

IslipMinor
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Re: Gearbox woes

Postby IslipMinor » Sun Mar 10, 2019 3:10 pm

Extract from the BMC Workshop Manual shows how the clutch pedal return spring is fitted.
Minor Clutch Mechanism.jpg
Minor Clutch Mechanism.jpg (166.59 KiB) Viewed 559 times
It's a strong spring, so be careful when fitting it!
Richard



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Re: Gearbox woes

Postby johngrigg » Sun Mar 10, 2019 11:52 pm

Thanks Neil and Richard. As I said in my post that spring which I perhaps wrongly called the 'clutch arm spring' is all present and correct. What I was asking about is the additional spring1G5999 mentioned by Phil the Hill and shown as item 40 on the link he posted. It may possibly be the brake pedal return spring and if I could open his link I might be able to confirm this.
Cheers
John G

ndevans
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Re: Gearbox woes

Postby ndevans » Mon Mar 11, 2019 7:05 am

Ah, I see.
I *think* it's the clutch pedal return for 803 & 948 cc cars, which explains why I haven't got one. Not sure where it fits.
cheers N
'69 Traveller, 1275, discs.

ndevans
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Re: Gearbox woes

Postby ndevans » Mon Mar 11, 2019 7:48 am

This diagram from the BMC Workshop Manual shows the part you are referring to as item 45. It fits, far as I can see, between item 46 and item 37.
IMG_20190311_072747~2.jpg
IMG_20190311_072747~2.jpg (1.27 MiB) Viewed 513 times
cheers N
'69 Traveller, 1275, discs.

myoldjalopy
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Re: Gearbox woes

Postby myoldjalopy » Mon Mar 11, 2019 9:21 am

Its a bit confusing as the Moss diagramme of clutch parts that Phil evidenced refers to item 40 as a 'pedal return spring' and then gives two types - one for 803/948 models, and then another spring for 1098 models.

However, the brake pedal return spring is given a different part number (AAA599) to the clutch springs in the illustrations for the brake system components: https://www.moss-europe.co.uk/shop-by-m ... minor.html It is more expensive than either of the two clutch return springs listed so must be different. As far as I am aware, the other end of the brake pedal return spring is attached to a tab inside the chassis leg.

ndevans
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Re: Gearbox woes

Postby ndevans » Mon Mar 11, 2019 10:15 am

You might be right about the tab inside the chassis leg. I have a 1098, so mine is the latter version, attaching to the engine backplate.
I wonder if Moss have got their diagram wrong, as the diagram I posted above is out of the BMC Workshop Manual, and is in the section for a Series MM.
cheers N
'69 Traveller, 1275, discs.

myoldjalopy
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Re: Gearbox woes

Postby myoldjalopy » Mon Mar 11, 2019 10:32 am

"I have a 1098, so mine is the latter version, attaching to the engine backplate."

That can't be right, because the clutch fork return spring (item 77) is the one which attaches to the engine backplate and is clearly different to the pedal return springs listed for both the 803/948 and the 1098 models (item 40). I can confirm my 948 engine/gearbox has the clutch fork return spring, attached to the engine backplate, but whether it also has a pedal return spring somewhere I have no idea.........

ndevans
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Re: Gearbox woes

Postby ndevans » Mon Mar 11, 2019 11:27 am

My clutch return spring definitely attaches to the backplate. Can't take a photo, it's in bit at the moment.
cheers N
'69 Traveller, 1275, discs.

myoldjalopy
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Re: Gearbox woes

Postby myoldjalopy » Mon Mar 11, 2019 12:32 pm

Yes, but that is the clutch fork spring (what 'johngrigg' refers to as the 'clutch arm spring'). John's query is about the pedal return spring, which is seemingly a different thing, according to Moss in their diagramme.........I said it was confusing! :-?


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