1098 engine starts, runs, cuts out, starts, runs....

[Alex_Posch]

Hello everyone,

I've got an rather confusing issue with my SII Traveller with 1098 unit.
She's been sitting in the garage for a year now as I sadly can't find enough time for her.
But yesterday I gave it a go: She starts good, runs good and for 5km or so, she drives as she should. No unusual noises, no lack of power or anything else.
But then, after she was running 20-30mins, as I engaged a gear and released the clutch, the engine died. Not all of a sudden, but with a bit of coughing, like she coudn't get enough fuel.
When died, the engine starts up again with the first turn of the key and everything seems good. Until you try to drive...

I hope there is someone who is able to help me with this problem.
The fuel pump is ticking fine, copper fuel line is a few years old, distributor and carburettor have been overhauled three years ago.
The only "old" parts are the fuel tank (may be dirty/rusty inside?) and the coil (what hot is too hot?)

Thanks a lot,
Alex

[alawrence10360]

I would be interested to know if when you undo the fuel cap is it under vacuum
It may be getting starved of fuel if it’s not breathing properly

[RobThomas]

Had the same. Lifted wooden boot floor, undid screws holding down fuel sender, looked inside, filter gauze on end of intake pipe to pump clogged with crud and dust from respray. Good clean out and it worked fine. Might be the same issue?

[pgp001]

Check the piston is free to move on the SU carb, that can have a similar effect if it is sticking intermittently.

Phil

[myoldjalopy]

And check there is sufficient oil in the dashpot.....unlikely to be the coil, especially if its a good, old one.

[kevin s]

Had the same, it was the gauze on the fuel pick up but on ours you can't get to it to clean it. Blowing backwards through the fuel line fixed it but to be sure I added a new pick up incorporated into the sender unit.

[liammonty]

All the replies so far have focussed on the fuel system, but don’t rule out the ignition system. I’ve had faulty coils and faulty rotor arms that have both caused those symptoms in the past.

[Alex_Posch]

Thank you so much for the numerous answers! I'm going to check the points on friday.

[paul 300358]

When checking the points replace the condenser.

[Alex_Posch]

I also checked the carb, the ignition and the fuel cap, but I'm prettty sure it was the fuel system.
The fuel tank is full of rust and fuel filter was clogged...
Thank you lot!

[Alex_Posch]

Well, ist was not the rusty tank... Would have been too easy.

It was ok for a while, but then it startet again.
So I thought, it can't be anything with the fuel system as i changed the tank, filter and cleand the pipes.

I looked for the distributor, which was oily inside and the nut of the breaker had become loose, it was quite a mess and the low tension leads looked pretty worn.
I cleaned it all up, changed the breaker points, condenser, low tension terminal, rotor arm, cap und leads (all parts from Charles Ware's).

It didn't start up.

I noticed that the coil was getting pretty hot while trying to start the engine, so I got a new one from Lucas.

It didn't start up. Checked for a spark at the plugs and at the HT-lead. Nothing. By the way: regarding the Ohms measured, the old one should be fine...

So I thought, it could be the battery, as I once fitted an alternator with converting the system from +e to -e. Maybe it took damage?
Changed the battery.

It didn't start up. Checked for a spark at the plugs and at the HT-lead. Nothing

Maybe the wiring?
To check the wiring, I fitted one lead from +battery directly to the +terminal at the coil and another lead from the -terminal at the coil to the low tension terminal at the distributor. There should be current now?

Checked for a spark at the HT-lead and plugs. None.

So here I am, asking you what I have overlooked. Or did I make a mistake at assembling the distributor?
Are the low tension leads supposed to get contact to each other when fixed in the distributor? Or get contact to the mounting plate? What about the little white plastic rings that come with the breaker points?

Looking forward to any answers
Thanks, Alex

[kevin s]

For the ignition, there should be an ignition switched 12v to the plus side of the coil. The negative side of the coil there should be a ground when the points are closed and open circuit when they are open, a ground when the points are open indicates they are assembled incorrectly or the condensor is shorting.

Next check the coil, should gave around 3 ohm resistance

Next check the coil by taking the king lead out of the distributor and holding it a couple of mm from a head stud with insulated pliers, see if there is a spark as it cranks over if there is its either the cap or rotor arm, if not the coil or king lead.

For the fuel check fuel is getting to the carb by pulling the pipe off at the carb and putting it in a jar, with the ign on, it should pump fuel. If that is OK take the air cleaner off and see if there is signs of fuel coming through the jet, might also be worth taking the plugs out to see if they are wet.

[Trickydicky]

Ensure you have assembled the points correctly, if not it will short to earth and there will be no spark. If the coil is getting hot with the ignition switched on then it's normal, once the engine is running it will be fine.

[myoldjalopy]

As above - the plastic plugs are to prevent the contact breaker system shorting to earth, except through the points when they close.
They should be fitted - plastic plug, contact breaker arm, capacitor and LT leads, plastic plug, nut.

[Alex_Posch]

Still struggeling, but I'm not about to give up!
The problem evolved, now the engine cuts out when warm, after about 5-10 mins driving or 15-20 mins idling and won't start again without given some time to cool down (it is not overheating, water and oil temperature is normal)

As all the electrical/fuel/ignition components are new, reconditioned or tested o.k. and set right, I've done a compression test.
Readings are:
Cold: 120, 130, 135, 130 psi
Warm: 120, 110, 100, 110 psi
Warm, with a little bit of oil in the cylinders: 180, 200, 210, 200 psi.
I guess there's a copmression-issue when getting warm, and regarding the "wet" test it looks like there's a problem with the piston-rings, isn't it?

Any similar experiences or advice?

Here's a short clip what it's like when it passes out while idling. (There's still my spare coil mounted for a quick swap, it didn't help anyway...)
https://streamable.com/ntdk1a

[pgp001]

Your compression readings might not be fantastic, but that alone should not cause the engine to just stop running.
So you need to check things in a logical manner and determine if it is a spark problem, or a fuel problem.
Then once you know which it is you can logically eliminate components one at a time till you find the culprit.

It does sound like it has run out out of fuel in the video.

Will it start up again straight away ?
Can you hear the pump ticking, and if so is it ticking slowly or rapidly.
If you remove the float bowl lid as soon as it has stopped, is there any fuel in there ?

If you remove the fuel pipe from the carb and put into an open container (take suitable fire precautions) then switch the ignition on, the pump should start pumping fuel, can you gat an idea of how much it is delivering and time it for volume over a set time. From memory you are wanting to see approx 1 pint per minute. And this should be able to keep going at the same rate.
You mentioned rust in the fuel tank, have you cleaned the inlet filter on the pump ?

If you take out a plug and check for a spark straight after it stops, is there one ?...What colour is the spark.

Phil

[kevin s]

Have you changed the rotor arm?

I seem to recall there being a problem with something about a loose rivet when they warm up on a number of pattern ones.

[kevin s]

Have you changed the rotor arm?

I seem to recall there being a problem with something about a loose rivet when they warm up on a number of pattern ones.

[kevin s]

Have you changed the rotor arm?

I seem to recall there being a problem with something about a loose rivet when they warm up on a number of pattern ones.

[liammonty]

As kevin s said (3 times!) it could well be electrical from the symptoms you describe. The rotor arm failed on my Wolseley Six and was a pain to diagnose as it was fine when the car cooled down, which was when I tested it... I've also had more than one coil cease to function when warm, then work perfectly when cold. So I'd suggest (if you haven't already done so) that you check ALL electrical components when the car is warm and has conked out, before it cools off, as they may well test fine when cold.