Sierra 5-speed & Hydraulic Clutch Issue

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Monty-4
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Re: Sierra 5-speed & Hydraulic Clutch Issue

Post by Monty-4 »

Engine (and ancillaries) are unbolted and rotated in the engine bay, I've now gotten as far as replacing the flywheel.

There are two types of 190mm Ford clutch cover and release bearing available. Clurly fingers with a flat face bearing and flat fingers with a more curved face on the release bearing. I've been able to look at them side by side and these will result in different travel for the release bearing as the "curly fingers" effectively make the clutch cover thicker. I know the spacer and slave cylinder I have was used for one of these combos in a Minor in the past, but not which.

Any way to determine this other than possibly having to do the job twice?
68' 4-door Saloon, another 'Monty'.
philthehill
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Re: Sierra 5-speed & Hydraulic Clutch Issue

Post by philthehill »

You do not have to re-fit the engine and gearbox to get it right - all you need to do is mate the gearbox to the engine and see what the clearances are like through the spare fork lever hole. To that end I would try the curly fingers and flat face bearing first.

If there is not enough clearance on the first try use the flat fingers with the curved release bearing as my picture above shows.

I have used both types of clutch pressure plate and it is not difficult to try either. The centre/driven plate must be fitted when checking for clearance.

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Re: Sierra 5-speed & Hydraulic Clutch Issue

Post by philthehill »

Declan
Here is a photo of the hole (lower left) made in the bell housing to allow the clutch release arm pivot bolt to be fitted downwards. The hole does not interfere with or compromise the integrity of the bell housing.
Phil
Quaife box 1.jpg
Quaife box 1.jpg (997.54 KiB) Viewed 1500 times

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Monty-4
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Re: Sierra 5-speed & Hydraulic Clutch Issue

Post by Monty-4 »

Any tips on refitting an engine with the thing on the hoist?

I just spent a good hour or so trying to get the thing lined up and to slide onto the input shaft nicely. Just about got it to within the reach of the bolts with the flywheel teeth inside the bellhousing. Stick them in and pull it together? Even that feels like it will take more arms than I have!
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Re: Sierra 5-speed & Hydraulic Clutch Issue

Post by oliver90owner »

Just be aware that bolting it together to pull engine to gearbox can exert enough force to bend the clutch centre plate, if not aligned properly. My brother did that back in about 1969/70. Was on a105E. The engine back plate was a loose item on those and fitting was a “B”, especially where there wasn’t much space. He has never repeated that mistake....

Does it have the right size bearing in the flywheel? My brother came across most of the problems before I needed to dismantle a car. I stuck to two wheels until I was over 20. :D
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Re: Sierra 5-speed & Hydraulic Clutch Issue

Post by philthehill »

Regarding fitting the Ford gearbox to the engine:-

I always find it easier to remove the gearbox and engine from the car as a single unit and them separate the two. Then when required assemble/mate the gearbox to the engine before fitting the engine /gearbox assy back into the car..

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Monty-4
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Re: Sierra 5-speed & Hydraulic Clutch Issue

Post by Monty-4 »

Two small G-clamps across the two flanges to gently ease it togther did the trick! Next up - bleed the clutch and see if it works. 8)
68' 4-door Saloon, another 'Monty'.
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Re: Sierra 5-speed & Hydraulic Clutch Issue

Post by Declan_Burns »

philthehill wrote: Tue Feb 19, 2019 3:59 pm Declan
Here is a photo of the hole (lower left) made in the bell housing to allow the clutch release arm pivot bolt to be fitted downwards. The hole does not interfere with or compromise the integrity of the bell housing.
PhilQuaife box 1.jpg
Thanks Phil
Regards
Declan


Regards
Declan
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Re: Sierra 5-speed & Hydraulic Clutch Issue

Post by philthehill »

If you need to use 'g' clamps to bring the gearbox and engine together something is not right.
There is a good possibility that the bell housing gets damaged.
A good wiggle of the gearbox should see the two come together.

There are at least a couple of different dowels at the top rear of the engine - make sure that you have the right one for the dowel hole in the bell housing - if necessary amend the hole in the bell housing.

Phil

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Monty-4
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Re: Sierra 5-speed & Hydraulic Clutch Issue

Post by Monty-4 »

As I said I was gentle. The feeble little clamps were stopping the engine from swinging around while I jiggled it, adjusted the angle of the load spreader and the height of the hoist as much as they were pulling them together. I've now bled the clutch and watched it through the bellhousing holes as somebody else operates it. All looks well. Can't wait to get driving again!

That reminds me... have others come up with a solution for plugging the enormous viewing/access holes in the sierra kit belhousing? As it stands I suspect moisture is liable to get in.
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Re: Sierra 5-speed & Hydraulic Clutch Issue

Post by philthehill »

As far as I am aware there are only three holes in the bell housing

1...….For the R/H drive clutch release lever.

2,,,,,,,For the L/H drive clutch release lever.

3...….For to give clearance for the rack.

The L/H & R/H drive lever apertures can be blocked with blanking plug Pt No: 2A3076 (MOSS)

The rack clearance hole if similar to the Minor can be fitted with a blanking plug Pt No: 22G199 (MOSS).

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Re: Sierra 5-speed & Hydraulic Clutch Issue

Post by Monty-4 »

Thanks, a little persausion of those covers with a grinder has enabled me to close up the holes whilst allowing the hydraulic pipes in. Is it worth drilling a drain hole in the bottom of the bellhousing for moisture (and perhaps oil) to escape?

The car drives beautifully with a nice amount of force needed to operate the hydraulic system with the stronger clutch plate, the original was a little too soft and gave very little 'feel'. Many miles of happy gearchanges ahead, I hope!
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Re: Sierra 5-speed & Hydraulic Clutch Issue

Post by philthehill »

Yes it is a good idea to have the hole in the bottom of the bell housing fitted with the jiggle pin which when jiggled keeps the drain hole clear.

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Re: Sierra 5-speed & Hydraulic Clutch Issue

Post by Monty-4 »

After driving this around for a while I'm wanting to tackle the speedo inaccuracy. The car has a 4423/04 1408tpm unit at the moment and a 3.9 diff with 165R14s.

The speedo indicates ~30 @ 40mph with the error increasing to reading ~48 @ 65mph (reported by a friend ahead in a modern). This matches up with this old thread (viewtopic.php?t=61970), pleasingly enough started by the chap I bought the hydraulics off, such a shame that car was shunted and written off in the end.

Our missed adviser bmcecosse recommends a 1294tpm speedo to remedy this, but my naive maths indicates something like a 1000tpm would be needed to correct an error in the region of 30%. Am I doing that wrong in my head?
68' 4-door Saloon, another 'Monty'.
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Re: Sierra 5-speed & Hydraulic Clutch Issue

Post by Sleeper »

By my maths you need a 1039, nearest MM is 1000 , nearly 4% out , once again Speedy cables or 1040 mechanism from a donor...

John :wink:
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Monty-4
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Re: Sierra 5-speed & Hydraulic Clutch Issue

Post by Monty-4 »

I feel another trip to an autojumble to pick up a couple of Mini speedos is on the cards!
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Re: Sierra 5-speed & Hydraulic Clutch Issue

Post by Sleeper »

Monty
You have a PM....

John :wink:
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