New fan belt, now have red light

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Jenko
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New fan belt, now have red light

Postby Jenko » Sun Apr 14, 2019 8:15 pm

Hi, I've fitted a new fan belt (813) and new spark plugs yesterday , the engine starts and runs lovely, went for a drive for half an hour no problem, however today, I started the engine and the red IGN light is on all the time and won't go out. The belt isn't slack, lights work ok.
Any ideas to help a new Moggie owner please?

myoldjalopy
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Re: New fan belt, now have red light

Postby myoldjalopy » Sun Apr 14, 2019 10:20 pm

First check - it is possible you accidentaly pulled a wire loose from your dynamo/alternator when fitting the fan belt......go check the connections in this area.
If all electrical connections are good,clean and secure, the next question is 'Have you a dynamo or an alternator?'

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Re: New fan belt, now have red light

Postby Jenko » Sun Apr 14, 2019 11:58 pm

It's a dynamo

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Re: New fan belt, now have red light

Postby Jenko » Mon Apr 15, 2019 12:02 am

I'll check the connections in the morning. Good idea.
The belt was tight to fit. Even with all the Dynamo bolts slackened, it took some getting onto the pulleys.

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Re: New fan belt, now have red light

Postby mogbob » Mon Apr 15, 2019 6:22 am

Jenko ,
myoldjalopy 's advice should sort you out on the loose connection angle.
Given the difficulty fitting the new belt , just a thought , you were supplied with the right size fan belt for you car were you ?

As you will see from ESM's website there are a number of different sizes : -

http://www.morrisminorspares.com/search/fan-belt .If you picked up an after market belt , the code / product number usually includes the length in mm.

A piece of string placed /wrapped around the pulleys will allow you to remove the string and off the car , measure it against a tape measure. I assume that you've ditched the old belt so can't compare new with old ?
Bob

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Re: New fan belt, now have red light

Postby myoldjalopy » Mon Apr 15, 2019 10:29 am

With a bit of luck, you will find a connection on the dynamo was disturbed. However, if this is not the case then the problem is most likely to be a fault in the wiring elsewhere, or a fault in the dynamo itself, or a fault in the cut-out of the control box. Let us know if the connections are good and, if the problem then remains, we can take you through testing the dynamo and, if that proves to be OK, cleaning the cut-out contacts

oliver90owner
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Re: New fan belt, now have red light

Postby oliver90owner » Mon Apr 15, 2019 11:22 am

Not changed the battery polarity by any chance? See no reason why, but the dynamo may just need the field windings ‘flashing’.

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Re: New fan belt, now have red light

Postby Jenko » Mon Apr 15, 2019 11:32 am

Hi,
Sorry but I've no idea how Internet forums work, so I can't figure out how to reply to you all individually.
The battery wasn't disconnected so it can't have been put back on with wrong polarity.
The fan belt seems fine, it was a bit snug to fit, but has a bit of free play that needed tensioning once it was in place.
I put the avometer on the battery when running, it seems to hold about 12.3v. The headlights come on, don't dim or improve with revs.
I've just been into town in the car, the red light stayed on, but it started first time, several times while I was out.
I've looked at the connections, I can't see any that have been disconnected by accident.

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Re: New fan belt, now have red light

Postby Jenko » Mon Apr 15, 2019 11:33 am

Is it possible that the light is on, but there's no actual fault?

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Re: New fan belt, now have red light

Postby Jenko » Mon Apr 15, 2019 11:34 am

By the way, thanks for your advice and your time.

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Re: New fan belt, now have red light

Postby Jenko » Mon Apr 15, 2019 11:58 am

I've taken the battery off to give it a charge. 12.4 volts seems a bit low to me.
It'll be back on in an hour or so.
Please keep the advice and ideas flowing!

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Re: New fan belt, now have red light

Postby pgp001 » Mon Apr 15, 2019 1:11 pm

If all the wiring has been undisturbed, then I would have a look to make sure the voltage regulator and cutout is tripping in and out OK.
Another possibilty is that when you moved the dynamo to fit the belt, you now dont have a good earth path from the dynamo to the engine and back to the chassis.

Phil

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Re: New fan belt, now have red light

Postby Jenko » Mon Apr 15, 2019 1:27 pm

Thanks Phil, but how do I know if the regulator is tripping in and out?
Also, I'm trying to check Dynamo, but how do you know which terminals are D and F?
I see the terminals, one bigger than the other, but which is which?

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Re: New fan belt, now have red light

Postby Jenko » Mon Apr 15, 2019 1:29 pm

Good point about the earth pathway being disturbed.
Simple but often overlooked, as I did!
I'll check it.
Thanks.

myoldjalopy
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Re: New fan belt, now have red light

Postby myoldjalopy » Mon Apr 15, 2019 2:31 pm

OK, the F terminal is the smaller of the two terminals. And your low battery reading may indicate that it isn't being charged.

To see if the regulator is cutting out, carefully remove the lid of the control box by pushing back the securing wire clip and removing the lid and then run the engine. The cut out is the right hand bobbin of the two (as you face the car) and the contacts should be open when the engine is off or just idling. As the revs rise by opening the throttle, and if the dynamo is working, you should see the little contacts close on top of the right hand bobbin, thus connecting the battery to the dynamo. That's when your ignition light should go out. If they don't close, maybe the dynamo isn't generating sufficient power.

A simple test for the dynamo, if you have no voltmeter, is to slacken off the fan belt so the dynamo can turn freely and then, with ignition on, press down the right-hand (cut-out) of the two bobbins as you face the car. This connects the dynamo to the battery and the dynamo should then run as a motor. If it runs briskly, it is probably OK. Make sure the contacts separate again after running this test. Do not mess with the other (regulator) contact.

If the dynamo proves OK, and you have checked the connections at the dynamo end, I would be looking at the connections of the D and F wires at the control box end to check they are clean and secure. If the dynamo and the wiring connections at both ends of the F and D wires are all good then, after disconnecting the battery, try a light cleaning of the cut-out points with some very fine glass paper. If no joy at this point, my guess would be the control box has failed.

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Re: New fan belt, now have red light

Postby Jenko » Mon Apr 15, 2019 2:47 pm

Thanks MOJ
The points on the right coil of the regulator don't move, certainly don't close.
Does that mean my Dynamo is bust?
I've taken the brushes out today, cleaned the commutator, plenty of meat on the brushes, they move freely, springs are good.

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Re: New fan belt, now have red light

Postby Jenko » Mon Apr 15, 2019 2:55 pm

I tried to run the Dynamo as a motor, it does spin freely, but not what I would consider whizzing around. Not really sure how fast it's supposed to be spinning really

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Re: New fan belt, now have red light

Postby Jenko » Mon Apr 15, 2019 3:02 pm

Should the Dynamo still spin as a motor with the ignition switched off? Mine does.

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Re: New fan belt, now have red light

Postby Jenko » Mon Apr 15, 2019 3:39 pm

So I suppose it comes down to which component do I buy to fix the problem, the regulator box or the Dynamo?
I still can't see how changing a fan belt caused the problem in the first place?
Starting to wonder now, if I really did the right thing by buying the Moggie.
It seems like everything I've touched on it is a bag of *€<>%
I found a spanner and bolt wedged down by the starter today! God knows how long that's been there.
Recent replacement of the rear springs ended up costing me £700 as the floor was rotten.
Now it looks like replacing the fan belt is going to cost me even more.
Some things are just not meant to be, I guess.
I still need to fix this little problem before I can even consider what I'm going to do with it though, so all advice will be greatly received. I may not reply tonight, but please don't think I'm in a huff and ignoring you all, but I do have to go to work.
Thanks again for your time.

myoldjalopy
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Re: New fan belt, now have red light

Postby myoldjalopy » Mon Apr 15, 2019 5:25 pm

OK - the dynamo should run 'briskly' as a motor and without hesitation. And yes, I think the dynamo will run as a motor in the test I described without ignition being 'on', as you have found out.
Another dynamo test is to disconnect the F and D wires at the dynamo and tape off the ends so they can't short out anywhere and to then connect the F and D terminals of the dynamo itself together with a short piece of wire. Then connect the -ive lead of a voltmeter set at the 20v range to this wire and earth the other (+ive) lead to a good earth point. Start the engine and carefully increase the engine speed - the voltage reading should steadily increase. Try not to let the volts rise above around 18 or 19 volts or you may damage the dynamo. If you can only get a low reading (remember, the charge to a battery should be up to about 13.7/14.0 volts when the system is working properly) or none at all, I would say the dynamo is faulty and that would explain why your cut-out doesn't operate. If this test proves the dynamo sound, then I would suspect the connections at the control box, or the box itself. Do try giving those contacts a clean though, as I previously suggested, if the dynamo is proved OK.
Don't give up on the old girl yet. Often previous owners have neglected/bodged work on these cars and, at some point, this neglect will come home to roost with a new owner. But, at some point, all problems will have been rectified and then you have a reliable little car which only needs periodic servicing.


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