Morris Minor Owners Club

Dear Wise Members,

A plea for help:

I'm working on my 1963 positive earth moggy. Just sorted out the connections, reflectors, bulbs etc.. on the headlights but whatever I do, I cannot get the passenger side to work on dipped. It's fine on full beam and the drivers side works fine.

To give you the full picture:

1. Not sealed beam
2. New Lucas bulbs
3. Standard three wires to each (red,white and black)

Nearly at "grab a hammer " point...

Thank you in advance

Well simple answer is that if it's working on the Drivers side and not the Passenger side, there's a very limited number of connections and things to check. Like 2 of them.

Have you swapped the bulbs over to make sure it's not the bulb?

Quite literally there is the Snap Connector where it splits to go to the passenger side and the one on the passenger side to connect the lamp.
The earth must be OK because the main beam is working.

geoberni wrote: ↑Sat Dec 12, 2020 2:42 pm The earth must be OK because the main beam is working.

Unless the wires have been crossed, and it's earthing via the main beam filament...

Chipper wrote: ↑Sat Dec 12, 2020 3:31 pm

geoberni wrote: ↑Sat Dec 12, 2020 2:42 pm The earth must be OK because the main beam is working.

Unless the wires have been crossed, and it's earthing via the main beam filament...

The main is working, it's the Dip that isn't.
I was assuming that the simon hadn't crossed over the colours on the snap connectors.
Unless it's a broken filament connecting one to the other inside the lamp (as sometimes causes Brake/Stop light issues for people) I wouldn't make crossed connections my first choice.
So long as all the Black cores are connected together, then any other cross connection is just likely to cause the wrong lamp to light, i.e. Side instead of Dip.

That's what I was thinking of, where you sometimes see on rear lights where the indicators are earthing via the tail lights, causing both to flash!

As you say though, not usually too much to go wrong when it comes to Minor headlamp wiring.

Thanks for your thoughts chaps

I've changed the bulb, checked the wiring and am now thinking of fitting a candle...

Thanks for your thoughts chaps

I've changed the bulb, checked the wiring and am now thinking of fitting a candle...

Have you got a multimeter?

It's a very simple circuit, you just have to be methodical and work through it. No need for a multimeter, just a simple test lamp will work. The lamp earthing point is on the inner wing.

JOWETTJAVELIN wrote: ↑Sun Dec 13, 2020 2:13 pm It's a very simple circuit, you just have to be methodical and work through it. No need for a multimeter, just a simple test lamp will work. The lamp earthing point is on the inner wing.

No need for a lot of things, but many of them can make life a lot easier.
Even a test lamp isn't a lot of good if the person using it doesn't understand how to use it, or what they're looking for.

simonswaffield wrote: ↑Sat Dec 12, 2020 8:19 pm Thanks for your thoughts chaps

I've changed the bulb, checked the wiring and am now thinking of fitting a candle...

Well let's not go that route just yet....


You said:

3. Standard three wires to each (red,white and black)

But that's ringing warning bells.
The Side Light supply is Red
The Main Beam is Blue/White
The Dip beam is Blue/Red
Earth is Black
Can you clarify what your wiring is?

Is your car a standard, post Oct '63 with the final type of Indicator/Side light unit, or is it the earlier wiring where the side lights flash for indicators? If it is the 56-63 wiring, has it been 'modified' in any way to give you amber indicators?
I'm just trying to work out which wiring diagram suits your car.

Edit (the next morning) to add:
I've been looking at your post a year ago about Indicator Stalk problems and there you said it was a '61 car. Are we talking about the same car? It's not an issue when everything is working, but it's useful to know which diagram to look at.

Not sure what you're getting at there apart from confusing the issue as usual. A multimeter would not 'make life easier' in this case. And very presumptuous to think 'the person' doesn't understand how to use a test lamp.

JOWETTJAVELIN wrote: ↑Sun Dec 13, 2020 6:29 pm Not sure what you're getting at there apart from confusing the issue as usual. A multimeter would not 'make life easier' in this case. And very presumptuous to think 'the person' doesn't understand how to use a test lamp.

Well if you're not sure, why not keep quite and let the OP answer my questions?

Steady on. Berni only asked if the OP had a multimeter.

That was his only mistake - he, perhaps, should have asked “if the OP was using a multimeter”.

Not everyone knows how to interpret the results, if they have one, and nowhere did he even suggest the OP was incapable of using one.

Ascertaining how the wiring was checked is a major part of assessing the actual situation, and rectification can more easily proceed. Checking the wiring can mean any one of several different things, in my book.

That, in my view, puts JJ’s posts out of order.

Your view counts for nothing. As you are both clearly geniuses please do carry on making a hash of a request to help with an extremely simple fault.

JOWETTJAVELIN wrote: ↑Mon Dec 14, 2020 2:44 pm Your view counts for nothing. As you are both clearly geniuses please do carry on making a hash of a request to help with an extremely simple fault.

What make you think your views count more than anyone else's?
Who appointed you as arbiter of what counts?

Looking back at your history in the forum, you've had your share of help with simple faults in the past.
Faults are only simple if you understand the subject area.

I had 37 years as an aircraft electrical engineer and the oldest aircraft I ever worked on was a 1940s vintage PBY5A Catalina, so if that qualifies me as a genius when it comes to vintage car wiring, I'll gladly accept that.

Look what you've done now , Simon , if I was you I'd get down to Arkwrights and purchase four candles...


John

P.S. Location might help, if you're local I'd be able to assist.

Manchester

If simonswaffield is lurking without logging in, please log in and check your Messages.

you don't need a meter or test lamp, split the bullet connector on the driverside, run a wire from + battery to each of the feed wires(DON'T touch it to the black earth wire)and see if the main beam and dip now work, These connectors are notorious for corroding up,don't think I have ever had a car with them that hasn't at some time caused connection faults .If you still don't light up check the other ends of the cable .Again watch out for the black earth wire.If they are green with corrosion,boiling water poured onto them usually clears all the cr...p off. Good luck

kennatt,
he's already told us the main beam works both sides,

simonswaffield wrote: ↑Sat Dec 12, 2020 12:00 pm
Just sorted out the connections, reflectors, bulbs etc.. on the headlights but whatever I do, I cannot get the passenger side to work on dipped. It's fine on full beam and the drivers side works fine.

so the only line of concern, if everything was connected back up with the colours matching, should be the Blue/Red link across from the Drivers side to Passenger side. Perhaps it's the bulb holder, with a poor contact?
All easy enough stuff to check, for anyone that knows basic electrics, but a lot of people, of any age, have absolutely no idea.

The reason I prefer to have people using a meter, aside from the obvious wealth of information in the readings, is that it's only using a 9v (or less) battery capable of milliamps, so the person who knows diddly squat about electrics doesn't accidentally weld a cable to the bodywork with 12V/50APH (for a few seconds before it melts like a fuse).
Even electricians have been known to get careless and cause a big flash; it's not unknown for people to burn flesh on their fingers, I've seen it done.
As you've said, don't ever let a connection from the battery touch a Black wire, or any bare metal, like bodywork, engine etc.

But until simonswaffield come back, we'll not know anything more.