New MOT Rules?

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taupe
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New MOT Rules?

Post by taupe »

The Government have just started a consultation on changes to the current MOT exemption rules for pre-1960 vehicles - possible extending it to 40 year old vehicles (pre-1976) - although the EU would allow for 30 year old vehicles and/or other changes.

https://www.gov.uk/government/consultat ... c-interest

Big can of worms comes to mind.....especially as its due to yet another European directive!

Taupe
bmcecosse
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Re: New MOT Rules?

Post by bmcecosse »

This has been going round and round for a long time now............ :roll:
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Matt
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Re: New MOT Rules?

Post by Matt »

This is an official public consultation BMC... where people can express their opinions on whether there should be exemptions or not....

Its not the same as has been floating around previously
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taupe
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Re: New MOT Rules?

Post by taupe »

Yes

This is a new consultation

Proposal is limited mileage for historics and no exemption for modified cars so all cars will require an assessment or self certification...as I indicated this is a can of worms especially for any modified cars....

I know that I will not be accepting any nominal government mileage limitation for my classic bikes or cars.....

Taupe
RobThomas
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Re: New MOT Rules?

Post by RobThomas »

Unscrew the speedo?

Anything pre 1937(?) doesn't require a speedo so how is that going to work for limited mileage???
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Mark Wilson
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Re: New MOT Rules?

Post by Mark Wilson »

Does MMOC have a means of making an official response to the consultation? It might be more sensible to try and make the proposals workable than simply opposing them, eg suggesting a list of "standard" accepted modifications, eg 1275 engines, Marina disk brakes.

Mark
James k
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Re: New MOT Rules?

Post by James k »

What exactly is the intention of the proposals? Is it simply to try and remove classic cars from the roads?
Mark Wilson
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Re: New MOT Rules?

Post by Mark Wilson »

I think it's actually a fairly well intentioned bit of deregulation which will remove the need for annual MoT testing of all moggies. The mileage limitation and checking of modifications seem to be attempts to prevent abuse of the testing concession, and the MMOC or the Federation of Historic Vehicle Clubs may want to try and influence the details, eg how many miles, or what constitute a major alteration. Personally I don't welcome relaxation of annual MoT tests - we've all seen some pretty unsafe cars for sale, although some actually do have MoTs.
plastic_orange
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Re: New MOT Rules?

Post by plastic_orange »

Consensus on most responses I've seen is that the historic vehicle owner does not wish MOT exemptions for any vehicle, and that this consultation is not needed or indeed wanted. Just typical EU and our government meddling (again) when there are bigger problems facing the country. Neither did folk ask for their cars to be placed in the historic vehicle tax group.
Having said that, can I suggest that everyone has their say as we can't complain if we don't make our opinions known.
Limited mileage and what they class as substantial modifications should be alarm bells enough.

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Big Jim
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Re: New MOT Rules?

Post by Big Jim »

I seem to remember the French have some odd system . I don't think they want old cars to be used regularly and can't be driven outside the department (county) without some sort of permission . It is not a system that enthusiast like .

Nickol
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Re: New MOT Rules?

Post by Nickol »

Delighted to see this initiative. To understand it, you first have to study and read the directive 2009/40/EC and note what may be going to change. It took me a while to find the appropriate relavent text for historic vehicles. Here in Germany there is no exemption like in GB for pre 1960 vehicles even though the text in the British consultation paper reads


Under current GB and EU law all vehicles that were manufactured before 1960 are exempted from compulsory annual roadworthiness testing. A new European Roadworthiness Directive makes changes to the existing vehicle testing scheme, including the provisions for exempting vehicles of historical interest.

This is a very misleading description as it gives the Impression that the EU law has decreed pre 1960 vehicles will be exept from testing. This is most defiantely not the case. The respective paragraph from 2009/40/EC reads


Member States may, if appropriate, exclude from the scope of this Directive certain vehicles that are
considered to be of historic interest. They may also establish their own testing standards for such vehicles.
However, such a right must not lead to the application of stricter standards than those which the vehicles
concerned were originally designed to meet.


So, the British Government took it upon itself to introduce or rather waiver testing as per its right under the directive.

The new EU proposal it seems is aimed to provide more clarity und uniformity within member states and like all directives , undergoes a consultation Phase. (Unlike national governments who just impose things most of the time)
Where the British are likely to suffer a bit , is from modified vehicles. Should you decide to upgrade your 1953 with its 918 side valve engine to an Italo something or other, you would in most Continental countries lose the "historic vehicle " Status and be legally required to upgrade the braking System etc before it would be allowed on the road. In Britain, this is not the case ?

The flip side of Brexit, is that to take your Moggy over the channel could well require in the future some Kind of additional certification that it complies with EU regs. Of course, it is also likely that the UK would adopt the regs anyway but without being able to contribute to them....in which case it makes the Brexit meaningless.
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busguy
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Re: New MOT Rules?

Post by busguy »

Very informative. Until the last paragraph, that is.
RobThomas
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Re: New MOT Rules?

Post by RobThomas »

Part of the proposal is that older conversions be allowed to continue so adding an A-series to a series MM chassis back in the 1950s would still allow the car to be classed as 'original and unmodified', or at least that is how I read the documents.
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Nickol
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Re: New MOT Rules?

Post by Nickol »

For reaonably minded People that would not constitute a Major Alteration but that may lie in the opinion or even mood of a tester unless he had specific guidlines to follow.
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Big Jim
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Re: New MOT Rules?

Post by Big Jim »

Some classic car insurance schemes will not insure a vehicle with a on standard engine . Although it would affect me , I think it is a pretty major mod .

Matt
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Re: New MOT Rules?

Post by Matt »

My opinion is that and MOT exemption is a bad idea...

However in the case of pre war vehicles, there is so little to test, and most owners know what their car should do better than any tester, that an exemption would be realistic. Afterall... how many pre war cars are driven daily compared with late 50's ones?

I have taken pre war (1902 - 1928) vehicles to MOTs, and its normally "Thats pretty, any problems with it? No? Okay heres your ticket, £55 please..."
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les
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Re: New MOT Rules?

Post by les »

It would be interesting to know how many accidents occur, if any, because pre 60s vehicles were exempt.

Mark Wilson
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Re: New MOT Rules?

Post by Mark Wilson »

les wrote:It would be interesting to know how many accidents occur, if any, because pre 60s vehicles were exempt.
The Dft document doesn't fully answer this, but does give some relevant stats.

2014 - Pre 1960 cars 2 killed, 8 seriously injured, 19 slightly injured, 39 damage only. No data as to whether vehicle condition was a factor in these accidents, nor the relative figures, eg accidents per mile travelled for different ages of cars. The figures for the 1961 - 1977 cars, is the ones tested now which would be exempted, are 3 killed, 21 seriously injured, 105 slightly injured, 172 damage only.

In the overall scheme of things these are very small numbers and don't make a compelling case for changing the status quo.
les
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Re: New MOT Rules?

Post by les »

Thanks Mark.

Budgie
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Re: New MOT Rules?

Post by Budgie »

Whereas I believe that a car or any motor vehicle should have some form of valid MOT and I wouldn't dream of buying one without a valid ticket I do think that the cost should be at least halved and possibly every two years as opposed to every year.
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