Engine Plate/Number

[Monty-4]

Hi folks,

I've just finished building a new engine, the foundation of which was a bare block I got on a well known online auction website. After attaching everything else I realise there is a gap where the engine number plate would usually be riveted on! Is there a way to track down what this number would have been and stick a new plate on, or could I transfer the plate from my old engine over, or would this be frowned upon?

Thanks for any help.

[firedrake1942]

It would probably be frowned on but let me know how you get on as I have the number from the original engine in mine from the original buff log book and a Gold seal engine fitted in 1979 and have been thinking the same dark thoughts.

Frowned on for two reasons, i suppose. ringing of the engine and lack of originality.

I believe the rivets actually threaded and tapped in but could be drilled out. I do not know where yiuy would get a new engine plate to stamp original numbers in to though. I assume that attempting to remove the plate from the original engine you have would damage it.

[firedrake1942]

Just found this on line, If you do decide to go ahead!

https://www.minimail.co.uk/chassis-vin-plates/

or this, although the mini ones look better

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Classic-A-Ser ... 1764880579

These guys do plate and 'rivets'

http://www.retrominisltd.co.uk/index.ph ... 20a&page=2

and more

https://www.minisport.com/lmg1053s-a-se ... umber.html

[crossword]

Monty , originality is gone anyway with the rebuilt engine being fitted . You could speak with DVLA & ask how to proceed . You could rebuild the original engine & refit . You could fit a plate with a number relating to a " gold seal " type engine .
I would not fit a plate with the original engine number .
My MGB has an engine in the series 48XXXXXX indicating gold seal . When I tried to inform DVLA of this they required " proof " .
Why would I inform them of something incorrect ? That was 6 or 7 years ago & they are still not notified , so you could do nothing .

Regards Andrew .

[smithskids]

I changed the engine on one of my mogs a few years ago and made a plate of brass and stamped it with my post code and a date, they accepted this without a murmer.

[Monty-4]

Interesting!

How would I go about 'creating' a number for a gold seal type engine? Also - it's painted green!

The plan is to slowly (cheaply) rebuild the original but tired, old and leaky engine that sports the old plate and to keep it as a completely stock spare (although I might get tempted by 'invisible' mods like flowing the carb bridge and butterfly). The new engine has a different head, manifolds, carbs, dizzy, alternator and so on.

[palacebear]

Gold Seal engine numbers will be difficult to create. For an A-Series block, the first two characters were always '8G'. The next three or four characters were a seemingly random mix of letters and numbers which actually indicated rebore and regrind sizes. After this came a six-digit number which was the machine-shop job number. As an example, my 948cc Gold Seal engine number is

8G9 R J06****

[Monty-4]

Thanks!

I just called the DVLA. I need to send them a letter detailing the changes, after which they will amend the V5 to have a blank engine number or they will ask to inspect the vehicle and consider issueing a new one. Hoping for the latter!

[firedrake1942]

Some would argue, perhaps with a degree of justification that what is proposed is to alter the car's history.

However my gold seal 948cc engine (now a lovely shade of BMC green) has been in the car since 1978 and after several attempts to tell the DVLC as it was then about the new number, the most recent V5 still bears the original 948cc engine number, so I gave up. I could therefore have one of the new plates made with the original number on it, remove and drill out the rivets 8G gold seal number and fix the original number on and no-one would be any the wiser.

[les]

It would be much simpler to use the number from your original engine, if you put both engines side my side, what's the difference?--- No difference. Your original engine would then be without a number, as your rebuilt one, once was! We're not talking chassis numbers here, in fact many log books have a blank space where an engine number could be. Who would know you've changed a like for like engine?

[Monty-4]

There is one identifiable difference to the keen eye. The 'new' block has the fittings for a mechanical fuel pump blanked off with a plate, whereas the original was untapped.

It would certainly be simpler to have a new plate stamped and to whack it on.

[les]

These engines are so old now, that no ones interested in checking out every last detail, and you will not be getting the original number for the rebuilt one anyway. Let's agree to differ on the simpler course of action!

[POMMReg]

These engines are so old now, that no ones interested in checking out every last detail, and you will not be getting the original number for the rebuilt one anyway. Let's agree to differ on the simpler course of action!

Would agree with Les, some Oz engines had their numbers stamped DIRECTLY into the block - albeit excess use of "/" ie; 9M/U/H/123456 - just saying it'll save a lot of farting about, no-ones THAT bothered what number is displayed anyway!

[liammonty]

I’m totally with Les on this one - I can’t see the point in worrying at all about it, whatever you choose to do.

[philthehill]

Not yet awhile - but once there is a requirement to prove that there have been no substantial modifications carried out I am certain that there will be a requirement to have the engine number displayed - if and when the new MOT requirements are enacted.
See other thread for details.
https://www.mmoc.org.uk/Messageboard/vi ... =1&t=67444

[Monty-4]

The plot thickens then!

I'm still in two minds as to whether I write it all down and see what the DVLA want to do, or pretty much leave it well alone, sans-plate.

[POMMReg]

Have 80O, 950 or 1100 cast into the block, wouldn't this be good enough?

On the preservation scene, there's a Cowley built 803cc engined GPO Minor van, which has an engine from an Adderely Park van, will DVLA ban this from our roads?

[philthehill]

To be honest I do not think the block casting will hold sway - numbers is what does it.
Until the definitive answer on the 'substantial modifications' has been published who knows what is going to happen but all probabilities should be taken into consideration and I do believe that proper and original engine numbers for the engine fitted will be one of the requirements.
As regards the 803cc engine GPO Minor van - if DVLA are so minded and the 803cc engine has been replaced with say a 1098cc that increase in engine size could or may be considered to be a substantial modification and DVLA may make a recommendation or comment.
We should all be prepared for whatever is decided. If it does not happen we can all give a huge sigh of relief.
Phil

[les]

I can't imagine there is anyone out there, who could look at an engine number and say---- that number doesn't belong to that engine.

[philthehill]

Les
Whilst I agree with you as regards the engine specific number re the engine block - there are plenty of engine number lists out there on the web which from the prefix and other engine number details will give a good idea of the engine fitted and the size (cc) of the engine and the approx date that the engine was manufactured and whether that engine was an original fitment.
Combined with the other physical aspects of the engine it does not take a genius to work out if the original engine has been substituted for a later or larger unit and/or the engine number has been changed.
No doubt the people who are in the process of developing the proposal regarding substantial modifications will have taken this all into account.
Phil