Timing cover oil seal

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Bignig
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Timing cover oil seal

Postby Bignig » Wed Jun 17, 2020 7:03 pm

Help please. Novice, slowly rebuilding my 1098 engine which I started pulling apart ten years ago due to a small oil leak ( found to be coming from the sump gasket). Since lockdown I have been making good progress but hit a snag with this oil seal. I just cannot work out how to fit the new one. There is a recess on the inside of the cover and I thought that the new seal would just press into this but it seems too large to fit. There is also a recessed lip on the outside of the cover a little like for the cork gasket on the sump but smaller and I cannot figure out how the seal would fit into this either. I have bought three seals from different places hoping that one would fit but they are all the same. I am being stupid and missing a trick or do I have a funny cover. Really appreciate the help. Thanks.

jagnut66
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Re: Timing cover oil seal

Postby jagnut66 » Wed Jun 17, 2020 7:11 pm

Hi,
Can you post up some pictures to show exactly what you are trying to do and what you think your problem area is.
I recently changed mine over to a duplex chain and whilst I had some issues with the cam nut, the seals were easy and straightforward to fit.
Not very helpful to say this to you I know but that's why I'm asking for a couple of pictures to clarify your problem.
Best wishes,
Mike.
1954 Series 2 on axle stands needing more welding......

philthehill
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Re: Timing cover oil seal

Postby philthehill » Wed Jun 17, 2020 7:20 pm

Photographs of the timing chain cover would be appreciated.

The 1098cc 'A' Series engine should have a neoprene lip seal fitted to the timing chain cover from either the outside of the timing chain cover or as normally found from the inside of the timing chain cover. All of the 'A' Series timing chain cover neoprene lip seals are of the same dimension but not all of the same design and/or materials.

From what you have described It appears that you have the early timing chain cover with felt seal.


Bignig
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Re: Timing cover oil seal

Postby Bignig » Wed Jun 17, 2020 8:04 pm

Sorry, I hadn’t worked out how to do photos but hope these are ok. One shows the old seal that I dug out in pieces. The new seal seems too big in diameter, I even tried to press it in with my vice. I am doing something wrong. Thanks you guys.
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jagnut66
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Re: Timing cover oil seal

Postby jagnut66 » Wed Jun 17, 2020 8:26 pm

Mine pressed in just fine and fitted well, have any others on here experienced an issue with this seal not fitting?

Are you able to ask the supplier to replace it (in case they have sent you the wrong one)?
Best wishes,
Mike.
1954 Series 2 on axle stands needing more welding......

Bignig
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Re: Timing cover oil seal

Postby Bignig » Wed Jun 17, 2020 8:49 pm

I have tried every way I can think off but I can find no way that it will push in. I have bought three seals now from different suppliers to make sure but they are all virtually identical. I am at a loss.

philthehill
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Re: Timing cover oil seal

Postby philthehill » Wed Jun 17, 2020 8:57 pm

Right cover - right seal.
The seal has to be tight in the cover other wise it would fall out. Only the interference fit keeps it in place.
You need to place the cover outside down on the work bench with the recess flat and with a suitable large socket (fitted the wrong way round on a short extension bar) knock the seal into the recess. Take care not to damage the seal.
When fitting the cover fit the crankshaft pulley first (without the starter dog) to centralise the seal on the crankshaft nose and then fit the timing cover bolts/washers.
Tighten the bolts progressively around the edge. Turn the crankshaft to ensure that the seal is centralised before fully tightening the bolts.


Bignig
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Re: Timing cover oil seal

Postby Bignig » Wed Jun 17, 2020 9:04 pm

I have been watching a YouTube clip and the Morris Minor timing case cover in the clip seems to have a larger hole for the seal and is a slightly different shape than the one I have. I have attached another photo of mine. Can anybody advise on this. Many thanks once again for the help.
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simmitc
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Re: Timing cover oil seal

Postby simmitc » Thu Jun 18, 2020 8:50 am

Can you post a link to the clip so that we can see that cover too. thanks.

philthehill
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Re: Timing cover oil seal

Postby philthehill » Thu Jun 18, 2020 9:15 am

There are only two shapes of timing chain cover. Those without the tensioner bulge and those with the tensioner bulge.

Those two shapes may or may not be fitted with an oil separator/breather canister.
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As I said above you have the right timing chain cover and the right seal - there is only one size of seal but more than one style/material used.

http://www.minispares.com/product/Class ... o%20search

http://www.minispares.com/product/classic/LUF10006.aspx


Bignig
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Re: Timing cover oil seal

Postby Bignig » Thu Jun 18, 2020 9:16 pm

Thank you. I must be doing something wrong. If I cannot work it out I will take the cover to a local classic car garage to fit. If I learn anything helpful I let you all know.
The cover I saw on the clip was similar to the attached photo which is subtly different to my cover.
Regards
Attachments
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philthehill
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Re: Timing cover oil seal

Postby philthehill » Thu Jun 18, 2020 9:32 pm

The timing cover in the picture above appears to have the seal fitted from the outside.
The same neoprene lip seal is used whether the seal is fitted from the outside or inside.


Bignig
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Re: Timing cover oil seal

Postby Bignig » Tue Jun 23, 2020 11:35 pm

Finally solved the problem with grateful thanks to my local classic car garage. As you were all too polite to say I am a novice and I made a rookie mistake. A fresh pair of eyes soon put me on the right track.
I promised to report back if anything was to be learned so if anybody is interested this is what confused me.

I took off the timing cover and started to remove the oil seal. As the seal was maybe 50 years old it was very crumbly and as I did not want to damage the cover I had to dig it out slowly in multiple pieces. I stopped digging when I hit metal and cleaned everything up with a sandblaster so it all looked shiny and new ready for the new seal.

I did not realise that the old oil seal had an internal metal ring framework embedded within it’s structure to give it strength. So what I had done was to remove all the old rubber like material from the inner part of the old seal until I met the seal’s inner metal framework and I mistook this metal for the metal of the actual cover. Hence the new seal would not fit as I had not removed all the old one. Once I took a drift to the old seal’s metalwork it came out easily enough and as everybody said it was an easy task to fit the new seal.

Learning curve and thanks for everybody’s help. I am about to start on the gearbox so you may not have heard the last from me.

Keep well.


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