Horn earth wire.

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Gene Johnson
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Re: Horn earth wire.

Postby Gene Johnson » Sun May 02, 2021 9:33 pm

Opening this topic for my problem today. By the way, those of you with 30+ years of experience can be obstinate jerks, I've got 40+ years of experience and I'd never be so RUDE as many of your answers.
Anyway, I have a slightly different horn problem, one no one addressed to the original author's post' In fact, it may well have been his very question, and completely and purposefully and blatantly ignored.

I'm on the second go round of restoring my 61 LCV. The horn has not worked since I bought it in 1983 and due to serious medical issues, I chose to leave it when I replaced my wiring in 2009. Now I'm back at it actually, have been putterig with things since 83, completed the nut and bolt, repaint, etc in 2011.

My horn doesn't work because the wire in the steering column was severed before I bought the pickup from my Uncle Bob (really). I can plainly see the steering wheel end, with the spring end, but I cannot find the location where it exits to connect to the horns themselves. Obviously it doesn't wind through the steering rack, so where does it emerge? (I cannot find the impossible to fail inside the steering column exit point) I believe this was also the original question posed by the original questioner) I've visited all of my resource books (MANY) there is no description of this circuit.

geoberni
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Re: Horn earth wire.

Postby geoberni » Sun May 02, 2021 11:15 pm

Wow, what a resume; you joined the forum almost 7 years ago, and for a first post after all those years of lurking in silence, rather than ask a new question, decide to resurrect one from 9 years ago.
Then to really encourage people to help you, by way of introduction, you start by having a pop at previous responses....

Certainly a unique way of seeking help.

Best of luck with that approach, as they say on Dragon's Den, "I'm out".
Basil the 1955 series II

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StillGotMy1stCar
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Re: Horn earth wire.

Postby StillGotMy1stCar » Mon May 03, 2021 12:34 am

Gene Johnson wrote:
Sun May 02, 2021 9:33 pm
Opening this topic for my problem today. By the way, those of you with 30+ years of experience can be obstinate jerks, I've got 40+ years of experience and I'd never be so RUDE as many of your answers.

I'm also out.

bufferzone
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Re: Horn earth wire.

Postby bufferzone » Mon May 03, 2021 2:20 am

Mr. Johnson, I copied this explanation of how the horn works which should really help you. The wire that goes down into the steering column is only a couple inches long and pokes out a hole that contacts the underside of the castellated copper slip ring. Unfortunately, this site won’t let me upload the picture of it. Here is the text:


The way the system works is this:

The power comes through the indicator assembly to the copper ring via the thick contact attached to the flexible metal tab on the indicator assembly;

Under the copper ring, the ring makes contact with a wire that is poking out of the hole in the column and through the aforementioned plastic ring. The plastic ring insulates the wire from making contact with the steering column (which is ground; if the wire makes contact with the column, the horn will sound);

The other end of the wire is attached to the springy part you see at the top of the column with the metal button at the top;

The horn button is grounded to the column, and has a metal cup on its underside that hovers slightly over the springy button. When you press horn, the metal cup touches the springy button and completes the circuit: power runs from its source in the indicator assembly, through the copper ring to the protruding wire, through the wire to the horn button, and there finds ground where the horn button is attached to the steering column.

Lacking the actual parts, you can remove the springy button and extend the wire if it's been damaged and is too short, and thread it through the hole in the column.

Once it's protruding through the column, strip the wire and arrange it so it passes through the hole in the plastic ring and its exposed strands get pinched between the plastic ring and the copper ring when you fit the copper ring into place.

The important thing is that the stripped wire not contact the steering column as it passes through the hole.

When it's all assembled the ring assembly should be tight enough that it doesn't move. The "slip" comes between the copper ring and the contact tab on the indicator assembly.

Clear as mud?? �

The plastic part on my slip ring assembly disintegrated, and after a lot of trial and error I finally got everything working using a couple short pieces of garden irrigation tubing in place of the plastic and wrapping it with electrical tape to build it up to the thickness I needed to hold the copper ring in place. I also filled the hole in the steering column, around the wire, with silicone caulking as added insulation there.

ManyMinors
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Re: Horn earth wire.

Postby ManyMinors » Mon May 03, 2021 6:36 pm

I found this picture of a horn earth contact set. It was also used on the Mini and BMC 1100 etc. It is still available as a spare part.
Horn contact set.JPG
Horn contact set.JPG (179.63 KiB) Viewed 419 times

jagnut66
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Re: Horn earth wire.

Postby jagnut66 » Wed May 05, 2021 9:44 pm

Hi,
As an aside I have just removed this set up from Elsie May:
Air Horns.JPG
Air Horns.JPG (1.13 MiB) Viewed 386 times
They played the 'Dukes of Hazard' tune, really loud.
Not my thing really.......
So I am now left with a standard horn, which doesn't work............ :roll: :lol:
It was really grotty and one of the wires, which I beleive feeds back to the steering column, seems to have been broken (there was current to the horn but no current on the wire at the back of the column). Also they were both covered in verdigris.
So we'll see if it works when I've finished cleaning / repainting the horn (and polishing the brass centre nut :D ).
Best wishes,
Mike.
1954 Series 2: 4 door: "Sally" -- on axle stands needing more welding......
1955 Series 2: Traveller: "Elsie May" -- on the road and enjoying her 'as is' for now but I see work ahead......
1970 Triumph Herald 1200: "Hetty" -- driven back from Llangollen in Wales

jagnut66
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Re: Horn earth wire.

Postby jagnut66 » Fri May 07, 2021 1:48 am

Update: Some TLC in the form of a good clean and repaint, plus the wiring connections remade and the original horn is now back in working order. :D
Best wishes,
Mike.
1954 Series 2: 4 door: "Sally" -- on axle stands needing more welding......
1955 Series 2: Traveller: "Elsie May" -- on the road and enjoying her 'as is' for now but I see work ahead......
1970 Triumph Herald 1200: "Hetty" -- driven back from Llangollen in Wales

johngrigg
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Re: Horn earth wire.

Postby johngrigg » Sun May 09, 2021 1:39 am

Manyminors where is it available please. ?I can't find it on ESMCheers JohnG

ManyMinors
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Re: Horn earth wire.

Postby ManyMinors » Sun May 09, 2021 10:27 am

johngrigg wrote:
Sun May 09, 2021 1:39 am
Manyminors where is it available please. ?I can't find it on ESMCheers JohnG
Luckily there are plenty of other specialists. Nobody can stock everything. I cannot remember who I purchased mine from - I just went through the advertisers in Minor Matters until I found a supplier who had a good secondhand one in stock. Bull Motif Spares have new ones listed: "Horn slip ring BCA4505" if you prefer a new one.

geoberni
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Re: Horn earth wire.

Postby geoberni » Sun May 09, 2021 10:42 am

johngrigg wrote:
Sun May 09, 2021 1:39 am
Manyminors where is it available please. ?I can't find it on ESMCheers JohnG
Internet Search for it, ESM are not the only place for spares...

I've seen them on ebay in the past and as ManyMinors said, it was widely used, so can be found on some Classic Mini or perhaps MG spars sites.
There's one on ebay right now, removed from a classic mini.
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/265059919058 ... SwA8pgDAcW

Used ones are about £60+ if you can find them, and there are classic spares providers Mini, MG etc, offering reproductions for about £120.
Basil the 1955 series II

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ManyMinors
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Re: Horn earth wire.

Postby ManyMinors » Sun May 09, 2021 4:01 pm

I certainly didn't pay anything like £60 for mine and that was from one of the specialists advertising in Minor Matters.

johngrigg
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Re: Horn earth wire.

Postby johngrigg » Mon May 10, 2021 12:37 am

Yes there are other suppliers,but I Am on the other side of the planet andI I use ESM for their extraordinarily quick responses and utter reliability. I've found in general if they don't have it no one else does. That being said at 120 or 60 quid I'll find a way around it. Cheers JohnG

don58van
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Re: Horn earth wire.

Postby don58van » Mon May 10, 2021 2:45 am

G'day John

Does 8 pound plus postage to Oz sound better? :o

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/373115862339 ... SwVCJeiEDy

Don

ManyMinors
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Re: Horn earth wire.

Postby ManyMinors » Mon May 10, 2021 7:18 am

Read carefully. That £8.00 is just for the plastic insulator NOT the whole assembly pictured :roll:


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