MOT issues

Post by **motown_junk** » Sat Aug 04, 2007 2:03 pm

Gladys - my traveller just failed her MOT. Some of the fails are can't be disputed - horn not working & headlamps not performing as they should.

However, I'm a bit irked that she's also been failed as the front seats "aren't safely secured" even though they're fitted in the same way as when she rolled off the production line in 1965 and are bolted down as tight as they'll go.

Another fail was that the "breaks not adequate and not supported by a servo" - they're in perfect working order and have just had new flexi hoses, shoes etc.

Any ideas as to how I can get around these two problems will be most welcome!

Post by **chickenjohn** » Sat Aug 04, 2007 2:17 pm

Ask your local branch for an MOT centre thats used to MOTing classic cars. Sounds like this tester is a clueless jobsworth.

You need a recommended Minor friendly garage!

Post by **Welung666** » Sat Aug 04, 2007 2:25 pm

motown_junk, if you tell us where you are then maybe someone local to you can recommend somwhere that is classic car friendly.

Post by **motown_junk** » Sat Aug 04, 2007 2:28 pm

Thanks, any idea how I can find a garage who's used to testing classic cars in Northumberland?

Post by **bmcecosse** » Sat Aug 04, 2007 2:42 pm

The seat issue is easily resolved - just bolt it down at the back - yes I know it wasn't like that before, but it is safer if bolted down. There is NO requirement to have a servo - so you should challenge that, however if the brakes (not breaks) didn't reach the required efficiency then you cannot challenge that - they must be faulty. Good working Minor brakes will lock all 4 wheels - that's pretty much what is required. A servo doesn't increase the braking efficiency - it just reduces the leg load. So - what efficiency levels were given for the brakes on the test machine - they should give you the figures recorded so you know which ones need attention. Even a 'classic friendly' garage can't pass a car with duff brakes !

Post by **motown_junk** » Sat Aug 04, 2007 3:26 pm

bmcecosse wrote:The seat issue is easily resolved - just bolt it down at the back - yes I know it wasn't like that before, but it is safer if bolted down. There is NO requirement to have a servo - so you should challenge that, however if the brakes (not breaks) didn't reach the required efficiency then you cannot challenge that - they must be faulty. Good working Minor brakes will lock all 4 wheels - that's pretty much what is required. A servo doesn't increase the braking efficiency - it just reduces the leg load. So - what efficiency levels were given for the brakes on the test machine - they should give you the figures recorded so you know which ones need attention. Even a 'classic friendly' garage can't pass a car with duff brakes !

Thanks for that. Should have explained - the brakes have been overhauled by a local garage who work with classic cars - just a shame that they don't test them too! They have said the brakes are fine and that the mot centre has a reputation for being difficult if it's anything outside the norm... just don't really want to bolt the front seats down (if only for the test) as it's one more potential rust spot and a hole in the lovely new carpet!

Post by **Welung666** » Sat Aug 04, 2007 3:36 pm

DON'T BOLT THE SEATS DOWN! How are your rear passengers going to get in?

Go back and demand the tester re-reads the regulations on testing a vehicle of that age. If he refuses to pass it after the other work is completed report him and the test centre to VOSA. I threatened my old test centre after he tried to fail my 63 for having white front indicators, I put him straight very quickly that they were designed like that and he read the regs and finally agreed with me.

Post by **Packedup** » Sat Aug 04, 2007 4:16 pm

http://www.motuk.co.uk/manual/contents.htm

Have a read through that, find the relevent parts the tester clearly has no clue about, and print them. Take the printouts and the car back to the tester, and mention the words "sideways" and "without vaseline" in your requesting he voids those particular fails.

Post by **jonathon** » Sat Aug 04, 2007 4:56 pm

If the brakes have just been overhauled then they will not be very efficient for a while until they are 'bedded in'. The last thing they need to test them is a brake tester as they do not want to be over heated , but gently bedded in. I'd agree with Lee on this, but challenge the original test rather than when having done the work suggested. You could also ask for a brake test to be conducted out on the road, this is a more representative test especially allowing for new parts. If the test did show glaring issues with the brakes then do sort these out.
Good luck.

Post by **bmcecosse** » Sat Aug 04, 2007 7:08 pm

Only bolt down the driver's seat - it's the one they are concerned with - but it was just an easy (and safer) option rather than getting into a battle with them about it. I have to fit a 'non adjustable' seat to my car each time - they argue the adjustable seat is too loose - but it is exactly as when new - it's just easier to stick the other seat in for the test (along with the new wiper blades and the good set of tyres) - all promplty removed after the test and safely stored away for next year. If the brakes really do lock all four wheels (and the handbrake locks the back wheels) then they will pass. If they don't - then back to the 'garage' who did the 'overhauling' !! As I said before - what efficiency figures did they givce you - these will reveal all.

Post by **eastona** » Sat Aug 04, 2007 8:38 pm

Things like this make me really cross.

As BMC says, what are the efficiency figues for the brakes?

My car is totally standard (except for an alternator and halogen headlights) and passes no problem. The garage just knows what it's looking at.

They seem to quite enjoy testing it.

Andrew

Post by **kennatt** » Mon Aug 06, 2007 8:30 am

get it challenged and threaten to report him to the ministry he obviously dosn't know what he's doing

Post by **bmcecosse** » Mon Aug 06, 2007 11:28 am

He will then get his fine tooth comb out - and go over the car even more carefully finding every little detail wrong with it - suspension bushes/joints with wear/steering column bushes/headlight alignment/rust spots/tiny fraying on seat belts/tiny marks on windscreen glass - you name it he can make a list a mile long if he wants. Don't go there - just learn the lesson and take it somewhere more reasonable.

Post by **rayofleamington** » Mon Aug 06, 2007 1:35 pm

I've had some Minor seats that were loose in the saddle clamps - even when the saddle clamps were bolted up tight - this allows the seat to rock a bit sideways. Are you 100% sure they are ok?
A decent Minor seat that is well fitted should not be able to rock - and will probably hold itself against the dashboard when pushed forwad.
To acheive that, you can pack a bit more carpet under the seat runner where it fits into the saddle clamp.

As for lack of Servo - the car never had one, therefore if the brakes are in good order, it should stop sharply on a road test. New brakes are, as previously mentioned, likely to be quite poor until they've bedded in

This can be a problem with MOT's but if that's the reason then I'd I blame the quality (poor fit) of new shoes more than the MOT station.

Back to the bigger picture - if the MOT station is not classic car friendly, I'd cut my losses and ask around to find one that is.
I also have / have had a few Land Rovers.
Even with good steering there is a lot of play at the steering wheel, so they need a Land Rover friendly garage that knows how to tell the difference between 'good' and 'not good' steering.

I'm fortunate to know an MOT station local to me that isn't worried by my 'wierd' cars, however I don't know if they are going to be ok with the Landy. Time will tell.

Post by **bmcecosse** » Mon Aug 06, 2007 2:25 pm

Agree - the seat should not be loose in the saddle clamps - packing of carpet or I usually wrap th seat front bar with a few layers of black tape - can be fitted to tighten it all up so the bolts then hold it down very firmly - but it can still be tipped forward with a struggle if required.

Post by **steve4063** » Mon Aug 06, 2007 6:27 pm

i'll agree with classic friendly mot places there was one near where i used to live in suffolk who HATED classics said "they shouldn't be on the road at that age"

so if ever he had one he would fail it

so it is worthwile going somewhere who knows and likes classic cars

surely there's someone who lives your area who knows of an mot place.

pity you're not local to me i use march end motors in wolverhampton.
he mots about 10 moggies a year and is REALLY helpful and kind generally a brill bloke.

will even lend you screwdrivers etc to sort stuff out while he's testing something else

like when my light went on the way to the station

good luck with it and i'm sure you'll get it saorted soon

Post by **eastona** » Mon Aug 06, 2007 7:39 pm

Rayofleamington, I had a convo with my MOT station a few months ago about this, and with a LR you're allowed more play in the steering because it's a steering box, whereas with the minor it's a rack and so the allowable play is smaller. That's what he said anyway.

Motown Junk, Agree with general sentiment, give your business to someone better.

Andrew

Post by **eastona** » Mon Aug 06, 2007 7:41 pm

13mm for rack and pinion

75mm for non rack and pinion,

That's 3"

Post by **moggyminor16** » Mon Aug 06, 2007 11:14 pm

if you bolt the seats down that should fail the mot unless both your seats are fold down ones or its a 4 door as its a safty thing if you have 2 pax in the back then both doors and seats have to move other wise in a acedent some may not be able to get out thats why if a 2 door seats are fixed then there must be a way of moving the seat back by a lever ,but a minor dont have this so there for must be able to move .if you look throw the H A S booklet about the cars and ages and there spects that they have to meet and it says in teher about the seats i have been there before but it helps when i just did the health and safty for the work which then i looked up about the cars and teh specks

Post by **moggyminor16** » Mon Aug 06, 2007 11:19 pm

steve4063
where in suffolk? as when i lived in suffolk in stanton the was a MOTer in stanton said to me my traveller had better be scrapped not worth any thing! so i took to another MOTer and passed with flying colours. I showed him teh failer sheet from the moter and then he called him to his garage and he truned up it was fire works. They was arguing over it truned out teh second MOTer was corect and i got my mot fee back from the dweeb but did get my own back ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha