1275 Engine conversion

[GeorgeHurst]

Hello,

I have a '66 2 door saloon (1098) and am considering converting the engine to a 1275 / 1300 / similar engine from a Metro/Mini.

I understand this will involve various mods to the rest of the car and was hoping I could pick anyone's brain about it. Answers to any or all of the questions would be hugely appreciated...

Will I need to get disc brakes (on all four wheels)?

A new axle/axles? And if so, from which cars?

Will it dramatically effect weight distribution, and if so in what ways and how can I rectify the issue?

New suspension?

Does it dramatically effect insurance?

Any other considerations?

Many many thanks for your time,

George

[bigginger]

You won't *need* a new axle, disc brakes would be wise at the front, it's roughly the same sort of weight, being basically the same engine.The old suspension will be adequate, though you might consider telescopic front shocks - rear too, if you have the cash.
I'd point out that the Mini/Metro engine is front wheel drive, and you're entering a world of expense and pain converting it to RWD. Better, I'd say, to find a RWD one to start with.
a

[GeorgeHurst]

Hi bigginger,

Thanks for the comments, very helpful. Could you recommend a RWD engine that I should be looking for that is about this CC?

(sorry i must sound like a complete novice, which I am, but I am keen to learn!!!)

Many thanks,

George

[bigginger]

The standard choice is Morris Ital, but keep an eye out for one from a Marina or Midget too
a

[GeorgeHurst]

Great, thanks for the help. I'll keep my eyes peeled!
Cheers, G

[bigginger]

They're not that common, but they do come up on the bay every so often
a

[bmcecosse]

While they fit quite easily - only the Midget engine is an almost 'straight swop' - the others do require some work to allow them to match up to the original Minor gearbox.
Why do you want the bigger engine - what is the main use of the car ? I ask because it is possible to get some more power from the 1098 engine without too much expense - so if all you want is to be able to keep up with the traffic, then I suggest that will be a very much less expensive way to go. If however you wish to do Track Days/compete in Hill Climbs etc then indeed a good 1275 Midget engine is the way to go! You really will need to improve the brakes and suspension if you intend to press on, and this work should be done first with extra power coming later.

[GeorgeHurst]

Hi BM,
Thats interesting to hear thanks, my brother has a Midget, shame I can't pinch the engine!
I would be interested to hear your thoughts on getting more power from my 1098 engine... I take my car on long journeys in the summer, down to Cornwall etc, as much as I enjoy chuntering along 7 hour journeys wear thin. So in many ways 'I just want to keep up with the traffic'. I'd definately like to hear more if you would care to divulge.
Many thanks,
george

[bmcecosse]

George - First thing is to make the best of what you have - make sure it's in tip-top condition and working as well as it can. More power comes from bigger valves (12G940 head from a 1275 Mini/Metro engine) and a bigger carb and good alloy inlet manifold - MG Metro units are popular! A better exhaust manifold and larger bore exhaust system are next - but not essential if you want to make the improvements in stages. As before -improve the brakes and suspension first!

[jonathon]

Go 1275cc as in standard form it will have around 20-25bhp more than a 1098cc, with mild tweeking 75-80 should be easily available at not too much money, you will also benefit from more torque which will make your long journeys more bearable.
You will need to upgrade the brakes either with discs or larger drums, I'd also be tempted to lower the car one spline on the torsion bars, fit front and rear gas dampers and a form of axle location. An upgrade to alloys with wider tyres will also benefit the handling.

[bmcecosse]

It's all down to your budget and whether or not you can do the work yourself!

[GeorgeHurst]

Great, thanks alot I shall look into both of those suggestions.
Thanks again,
G

[Packedup]

1275 engines seem to start at around £250, for allegedly running but quite sad looking ones.

The Midget 1098 10CC (larger mains) has a book spec of 59hp. The differences are head, exhaust and inlet. I was under the impression the cam was a little warmer too, but have been informed otherwise.

A HIF38 and alloy inlet can be had for 20 -30 quid which sorts the inlet, 295 heads go for anything between 30 and 100+ on Evilbay, leaving just the exhaust to sort. Bear in mind basic spec 1275 engines are only around 60 - 65hp book spec, though have more potential than the 1098 lumps.

Midget 1098 engines can be had for a lot less money than 1275 ones, though if anything are rarer (I got lucky and picked up an engine, 1275 box and various Midgety bits for 40 quid last year though). So if you want a bit more go on a budget then either a head swap and inlet/ exhaust tweak, or a 1098 Midget lump might be the most cost effective.

I can't see the box in sump A series engines being anything like cost effective, a decent 1275 transverse A series costs as least as much as an inline Marina/ Ital/ Midget one, and will take even more money to convert.

[GeorgeHurst]

Thanks packedup.

Having read all the responses above it seems like a 12G940 1275CC head swap, bigger carb (HIF38?) and new inlet manifold is the way to go considering my budget and the fact i just want a little extra go.

I gather from the above I will now need to look at uprating my suspension and brakes. And possibly the exhaust. Again, being a novice to this, could anyone tell how I should uprate these things...

Disc brakes? Brake servo and existing drums? What other models of cars can I pinch disc brakes off? All four wheels need new sus and brakes?

(Also can I ask if the 1275CC head is a straight swap for my current one? Or will I need to make adjustments/get it machined?)

Many thanks for your time,
George

[dunketh]

You dont need to upgrade anything to go to a 1275 engine.

Brakes, suspension, etc.. is all perfectly up to the job provided its a standard 1275 lump. There's a lot to be said for the old 8" drums, in good nick they're great.

I have a comprehensive 'step by step' guide to swapping the engines over including any potential pitfalls involved (of which there are a few).
This has been updated and corrected since I originally posted it on here a couple of years back.
If you need a copy I can email it to you.

Does it dramatically effect insurance?

Mine went up by a whopping £10 per annum.

[GeorgeHurst]

Hi Dunketh,

That would be very kind thank you very much indeed, I'm not sure if I will go as far swapping the entire engine yet but I would be interested to read about it none the less and for future reference. My email add is georgehurst86@hotmail.com

As I mentioned before, I will probably just swap the head, carb and manifold for the moment, you think the brakes and sus will be ok as is?

Cheers, George

[dunketh]

As I mentioned before, I will probably just swap the head, carb and manifold for the moment, you think the brakes and sus will be ok as is?

Make sure you cost it all up. A complete 1275 Midget engine can often be had for £150 - £200 and it is the better option imo. Certainly gives a lot more torque if not a huge increase in outright speed.

I think the brakes and suspension will be fine provided they're in good condition. I regularly drive mine on motorways and fast A roads and the drums have been fine. They do overheat on very hot summer days but you just back off a little when this happens.

File is on its way.

[GeorgeHurst]

Brill, thanks for the file and the advice. I think I shall have to get my calculator out, work out a budget and then see where I go from there.
Thanks again, G

[wanderinstar]

Jonathon,
Did i read right then. Disc brakes or LARGER DRUMS!!!!!! Don't tell me you are finally coming round to our way of thinking?

[jonathon]

Never been against larger drums . I just have a preference for disc brakes.