REAR AXLE HUB OIL SEAL

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ianmack
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Re: REAR AXLE HUB OIL SEAL

Post by ianmack »

Handy that this post has reappeared just when I'm doing an axle, I could have done with it yesterday when I dismantled it. I forgot the near side hub has a left hand thread and Mister Haynes neglects to mention it. I'm puzzled by the mention of drain holes, I can't find them despite wire brushing and poking about. Should all axles have them? Mine is from the late sixties.
ianmack
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Re: REAR AXLE HUB OIL SEAL

Post by ianmack »

It's OK I've found them now, they were covered with under seal. Glad you mentioned them.
minortech
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Re: REAR AXLE HUB OIL SEAL

Post by minortech »

Working on this myself as I try to get my 1960 convertible back on the road. I have fitted a later axle bought on eBay as mine didn't have a filler in the axle case and I wanted to fit a 3.9 diff without it being awkward to fill with oil. The drums that came with the axle were a bit oily so I am changing the hub oil seals and bearings while I am at it. One bearing just fell out of the hub. Worried that the hub would be worn, I started to take a hub off the old axle. However, before removing the hub nut I could see the outer race moving in the hub. The other side was OK so I will use that hub. Neither of the hubs on the old axle (1960) had the O ring seal. When was the changeover that saw the O ring incorporated into the hub? Also, has anyone ever successfully used a bearing retainer adhesive on the outer race?
amgrave
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Re: REAR AXLE HUB OIL SEAL

Post by amgrave »

Yes I have used bearing retainer fluid before but not on a car. I used it on a cement mixer drum, similar situation though a bearing in a hub where the shaft sat that the drum ran on. If you use it, use it sparingly as it is surprisingly good at it's job. You might have trouble getting it out at a later date, I had to use plenty of heat to shift it (shows how effective it is).

philthehill
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Re: REAR AXLE HUB OIL SEAL

Post by philthehill »

There is no change over i.e. from chassis number in the wksp manual section HH10 relating to the fitment of the hub 'O' ring.
It just states that it was fitted to later cars but no doubt someone on here will come up with the actual chassis number, the date of change over and the middle name of the person who fitted the first 'O' ring :D 8)
The 'O' ring is a belt and braces solution to the leakage of oil between the flange of the hub and the face of the half-shaft.
If both faces are clean and true there is little requirement for the 'O' ring but of course it is better have the 'O' ring but it can be lived without.
As regards using bearing lock on the rear hub outer race - if you use it and it is very good at its job you will have a devil of a job to get the hub bearing out of its semi-blind hole as suggested by amgrave above; but as you have a spare hub(s) and you cannot remove the mechanically (Loctite) retained bearing from the hub at a later date does it matter! Rear hubs are readily available from the usual suppliers and 'e' bay.
I have used Loctite bearing lock on other bearing inner and outer races and it has done the job superbly but it is then difficult to change the bearing at a later date.
Phil

katy
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Re: REAR AXLE HUB OIL SEAL

Post by katy »

According to my BMC parts list # AKD743 (fifth edition) the addition of the o-ring was from chassis # 448801
Sorry, but it doesn't give "the date of change over and the middle name of the person who fitted the first 'O' ring"
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philthehill
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Re: REAR AXLE HUB OIL SEAL

Post by philthehill »

Katy
Many thanks for the info.
Pity about the date and middle name though :wink:

Seriously though I have looked in my hard copy wksp manual Pt No: AKD530H and sheet 58436 issue 4 and it does not give the change over chassis number - only as I quoted above.
I have also looked at the online version edition AKD 530 14th edition and it shows the same page 58436 & issue 4.
I have also looked in the general data and still cannot find it.
Can you please give me a pointer where I can find the change over chassis no.

Phil

bmcecosse
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Re: REAR AXLE HUB OIL SEAL

Post by bmcecosse »

While the bearing should obviously not be 'loose' in the hub - neither does it need to be 'tight', A hand push-fit is fine. When the half shaft is fitted - it's solidly trapped within the hub and can't move.
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katy
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Re: REAR AXLE HUB OIL SEAL

Post by katy »

Phil, I found the change over listed in the parts manual, not the service manual. It's on page H.4 of the parts manual.
According to my BMC parts list # AKD743 (fifth edition) the addition of the o-ring was from chassis # 448801
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philthehill
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Re: REAR AXLE HUB OIL SEAL

Post by philthehill »

Katy
Many thanks.
I have to admit I that the parts list reference in your post above did not register.
My current MOSS Minor parts catalogue whilst listing the 'O' ring does not state 'from chassis Number'.
I will have to look out for a genuine BMC/BL Minor parts list :D
Phil

Postscript note:

Searching on 'e' bay all of the parts lists are over the other side of the pond. :(

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Morris-Minor- ... 33a340ae6e

Anyone this side of the pond got one of the above or later they want to part with?

katy
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Re: REAR AXLE HUB OIL SEAL

Post by katy »

That's interesting. I bought mine from the UK. :D :D
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8eab
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Re: REAR AXLE HUB OIL SEAL

Post by 8eab »

I too have issues with oil leaking into rear brakes, but i am confused by the picture showing the hub oil seal, there is an O ring seal (which i have on my car) and the paper gasket, i know that my car has both the paper gasket and O ring fitted, but what is the point of using both.
should both be used together? the o ring just crushes the paper gasket,and i found my paper gasket was disintegrating where the o ring was in contact with it, is this supposed to be the way it is?

Would like to know the reasoning behind this.
philthehill
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Re: REAR AXLE HUB OIL SEAL

Post by philthehill »

The fitting of the 'O' ring was a 'belt and braces' solution to oil seeping out between hub flange and half-shaft.
If the half-shaft flanges and the hub flanges are clean and true there is no need for the 'O' ring.
The gasket should be used at all times even with the 'O' ring even though at first glance it does not seem to be right.

bmcecosse
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Re: REAR AXLE HUB OIL SEAL

Post by bmcecosse »

If oil is getting to the brakes- check the axle breather is clear, axle not overfilled, drain holes clear in the backplates - and are the rear bearings worn ?
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John159
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Re: REAR AXLE HUB OIL SEAL

Post by John159 »

There has been references to a hole in the back plate of the rear brake structure to allow any brake fluid leakage to exit so that the chances of the brake shoe pads getting damaged is reduced. I have two MM- one is for a serious restoration job- and both have the 'rims' around the plate meeting , not touching but nearly touching, and leaving a 1mm gap, at the bottom of the back plate. There is then a piece of metal welded on one of its sides to the back plate and which overlaps the above gap - I assume to reduce contamination from dust, etc. I assume that this gap has the same function as the hole being referred to in the back plate.
I know that the above is a bit pedantic but just in case I am missing something I decided to post it to have it clarified
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Re: REAR AXLE HUB OIL SEAL

Post by bmcecosse »

Perhaps early cars had a different arrangement? The norm is simply a small drain hole that needs to be kept clear with a bit of welding rod or similar.
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Re: REAR AXLE HUB OIL SEAL

Post by taupe »

John159 wrote:There has been references to a hole in the back plate of the rear brake structure to allow any brake fluid leakage to exit so that the chances of the brake shoe pads getting damaged is reduced. I have two MM- one is for a serious restoration job- and both have the 'rims' around the plate meeting , not touching but nearly touching, and leaving a 1mm gap, at the bottom of the back plate. There is then a piece of metal welded on one of its sides to the back plate and which overlaps the above gap - I assume to reduce contamination from dust, etc. I assume that this gap has the same function as the hole being referred to in the back plate.
I know that the above is a bit pedantic but just in case I am missing something I decided to post it to have it clarified
John

The hole is to let leaking axle oil out if the oil seal leaks a bit... not leaking brake fluid?

Taupe
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Re: REAR AXLE HUB OIL SEAL

Post by John159 »

Tks taupe for that you learn something every day. Must have been day dreaming. Makes perfect sence re for possible oil leak.'
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