Clutch Pedal through floor squeek, advice please

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Tudge
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Clutch Pedal through floor squeek, advice please

Postby Tudge » Sun Jun 08, 2014 6:04 pm

Hi there, Lola has recently developed a squeek from her clutch pedal, as I release the clutch. I've traced the problem to the side of the pedal rubbing on the left hand side of the metal gearbox cover plate, and so have ordered from ESM:

Washer - Locating Clutch Pedal (ACA5228)
&Clutch Pedal Draught Seal Rubber

Because neither of these were in my car, I can't work out how they go in, please help!

Does the draught seal go inside the car? or round the pedal outside of the gearbox cover plate?

Many thanks

Tudge
1965 2Dr - She's called Lola


philthehill
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Re: Clutch Pedal through floor squeek, advice please

Postby philthehill » Sun Jun 08, 2014 8:51 pm

The washer locating (Pt No: ACA5228) goes under the nut (Pt No: AJD8462) which is located on the extreme end (R/H) of the clutch pedal shaft. There are two flats on the pedal shaft that the washer locating fits over to locate and stop it rotating. The nut on the end of the shaft can be either a castellated or self locking nut - either is acceptable.
The Pad Pedal Seating (Pt No: AAA1938 or COM132) is glued to the upper face of the flat plate just underneath the pedal foot pad and which goes under the gearbox cover plate. Only stops the draught when the pedal is released :D


simmitc
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Re: Clutch Pedal through floor squeek, advice please

Postby simmitc » Sun Jun 08, 2014 8:59 pm

One typical cause of this problem is that the shaft and/or bushes have worn, allowing the pedal to tilt and thus scrape the gearbox cover. If the washers do not cure the problem, then strip completely and examine for wear, replacing as required.

Tudge
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Re: Clutch Pedal through floor squeek, advice please

Postby Tudge » Mon Jun 09, 2014 11:07 am

Thanks very much guys. Perhaps the locating washer is fitted then, I haven't had time to take the gearbox cover off and have a look yet.

I'm guessing something obviously wrong here though, as the draught seal thing shouldn't be holding the pedal off the gearbox cover? As in the clutch pedal shouldn't be rubbing even when the draught seal isn't fitted?

I'm guessing it's not the bushes in the pedal shaft as I don't get any movement from the brake pedal when i push on the clutch, or visa versa, but I'll just have to have a look I suppose!

Should be tomorrow morning, as I haven't got time before work today.

many thanks,
Tudge
1965 2Dr - She's called Lola


simmitc
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Re: Clutch Pedal through floor squeek, advice please

Postby simmitc » Mon Jun 09, 2014 1:14 pm

The pedal will be held up by the return spring, and will press against the underside of the cover. The pad will simply cushion the blow. Without the cover in place, the pedal will sit slightly above the floor.

Barry Brown
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Re: Clutch Pedal through floor squeek, advice please

Postby Barry Brown » Tue Jun 10, 2014 12:41 pm

Hi,

I've just been through the pedal saga so thought I'd share some pics with you as to how they fit.

I made my draught excluder out of 3mm foam rubber underlay (from my model railway scenic spares). With a bit of contact adhesive it should stay put.

BTW - I used the same stuff to line the back of the battery box to deaden the sound and still allow the rubbers to fit as I couldn't locate the correct vinyl sheet. I've also put a layer over the top of the bonnet frame to dull the resonance.

For the distance collar make sure that the fit isn't too tight or it will increase pedal effort. It will also try to undo the nut and will destroy the split pin without you realizing and then the nut falls off. Conversely if it is too loose you may need to pack out under the castellated nut to ensure that the split pin locates snuggly in the nut.

Regards,
Barry
[frame]Image[/frame]

Tudge
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Re: Clutch Pedal through floor squeek, advice please

Postby Tudge » Tue Jun 10, 2014 6:17 pm

Cracking, thanks very much Barry. Couldn't have a look at the clutch today as had to replace tappet chest gaskets before work today. (the PO had fitted the wrong ones - the rubber ones designed for later type covers; if anyone on here owned FFN875C at any point, I'd like to have a word with them about their standard of work haha)

The pictures are a great help.
1965 2Dr - She's called Lola


philthehill
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Re: Clutch Pedal through floor squeek, advice please

Postby philthehill » Wed Jun 11, 2014 9:56 am

The washer (Pt No: ACA5228) under the castellated nut should not rotate on the clutch pedal shaft as it is restrained from doing so by the two flats on the clutch pedal shaft and the two internal flats in the washer and therefore has no influence on the rotation of the castellated nut so should not be an issue as regards the split pin.
The castellated nut should be tightened and then tightened further by only what is required to allow the split pin to be fitted. It should not be backed off to allow the split pin to be fitted. I have never had to pack out the nut to get it right but of course that is predicated upon the chassis rail being original spec/diamensions.
The clutch/brake pedal has a built in safety control in that if the nut and washer were completely lost the pedal would still operate safely as the sideways movement towards the centre of the car would be restrained by the clutch pedal slot in the gearbox cover.


Tudge
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Re: Clutch Pedal through floor squeek, advice please

Postby Tudge » Thu Jun 12, 2014 11:59 pm

Got round to taking the pedal shaft & clutch linkage apart today, things were in a fairly sorry state!

The pedal shaft was pretty worn out, as were the clevis pins on the clutch linkage.

Will order replacement parts asap, but for now i've had to put everything back how it was (except cleaned and greased).

I couldn't see that the clutch pedal was slanting at all though, there was a mm or two play in it side to side along the shaft, but the pedal wouldn't lean as such, so I can't see why it would be rubbing on the gearbox cover? The same goes for the brake pedal, it's rubbing, but with no play.

Perhaps my gearbox cover isn't made right? It's obviously had some ham - fisted modification to it around the pedals, perhaps the PO had the same problem...

Finally, I've not managed to get all the screws back in when replacing the cover, the holes are MILES off lining up :-?

I put as many as I could in loose, to align the cover as well as i could, but it really isn't fitting properly :x

Many thanks everyone[frame]Image[/frame]
1965 2Dr - She's called Lola


bmcecosse
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Re: Clutch Pedal through floor squeek, advice please

Postby bmcecosse » Fri Jun 13, 2014 12:25 am

Hmmm - suggests perhaps a 'twist' in the bodyshell ??
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Tudge
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Re: Clutch Pedal through floor squeek, advice please

Postby Tudge » Fri Jun 13, 2014 10:32 am

OH NO, I hope not :cry: Anyway I can check for this? Cheers
1965 2Dr - She's called Lola


simmitc
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Re: Clutch Pedal through floor squeek, advice please

Postby simmitc » Fri Jun 13, 2014 1:15 pm

When refitting the cover, remember that the cage nuts are loose, so a thin rod (screw drivers?) pushed through the holes in the cover and then into the nuts (don't damage thread) can be used to lever the cover around to line things up.

Tudge
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Re: Clutch Pedal through floor squeek, advice please

Postby Tudge » Fri Jun 13, 2014 1:21 pm

Is it a common problem (not having the holes in the gearbox cover line up) then? If so, I'm happy, and I'll just use a bit of force to wrestle the cover where I want it hehehe

Cheers everyone
1965 2Dr - She's called Lola


aupickup
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Re: Clutch Pedal through floor squeek, advice please

Postby aupickup » Fri Jun 13, 2014 2:15 pm

doubt if its body twist
holes not lining up could be a number of things, like replaced chassis legs, and there is a lot of movement on the gear box cover
its a fairly common thing if the car has been worked on which many have

mine had no welding done in that area and all original and the holes still needed a little tweek

philthehill
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Re: Clutch Pedal through floor squeek, advice please

Postby philthehill » Fri Jun 13, 2014 8:38 pm

There is at least 20K left in that clutch shaft :wink:
It always seems to be the bushes in the brake pedal pivot that wear away at the pedal shaft. Never had a problem with the bushes at either end of the pedal shaft or wear to the shaft in those places. My Minor has done over 80K and no wear in the chassis rail bushes. To over come the brake pedal bushes wearing the pedal shaft and so as not to encounter that problem in the future I fitted a grease nipple to the brake pedal so it can be greased on a regular basis. The grease nipple used was a 90 degree nipple and positioned it so the end of the nipple is just under the floor; I cut a hole in the floor just big enough to get the grease gun on the nipple and the jobs done and no more pedal shaft wear. The bushes at either end of the pedal shaft and located in the chassis leg can be given a squirt of oil easily from beneath so no real need to fit a grease nipple for those bushes though I have heard of people fitting them.
As regards the gearbox cover screws it was not unusual even when the car was new for the holes not to line up exactly and a bit of help was needed in the form of a fine tapered punch to line up the hole in the cover and the captive nut in the chassis rail before the screw could be fitted and screwed home.


Tudge
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Re: Clutch Pedal through floor squeek, advice please

Postby Tudge » Fri Jun 13, 2014 11:38 pm

Cracking cheers for the advice. And grease nipples on the pedal shaft is a stroke of genius! Weird thing is, the cover had all of it's bolts in place before I took it out, so perhaps I just bent the cover when i was taking it out & scraping off the inch thick layer of sealant stuff on the underside (not the waxoil - it was sortof like window putty). As another question - does anyone use any sealing method for the cover, or just bolt it down?

Thankyou!
1965 2Dr - She's called Lola


philthehill
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Re: Clutch Pedal through floor squeek, advice please

Postby philthehill » Sat Jun 14, 2014 7:31 am

You should use sealant between the gearbox cover and the chassis rails/floor for stopping any water ingress into the car and chassis rails.
What I use is a thin bead of DUM DUM between the cover and the chassis rails/floor, tighten it all down and then cover the joint inside the car with Brushable Seam Sealer (available from http://www.frost.co.uk ). You can also under seal over the underside joint if required.
Marine chandlers are a good source of alternatives to DUM DUM and seam sealer.


Tudge
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Re: Clutch Pedal through floor squeek, advice please

Postby Tudge » Sat Jun 14, 2014 11:50 am

Tidy, cheers. I think that was the sort of stuff that I took off the cover when I removed it. But it was a good 3/4 of an inch thick in places!
1965 2Dr - She's called Lola


Tudge
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Re: Clutch Pedal through floor squeek, advice please

Postby Tudge » Sat Jun 14, 2014 4:35 pm

Just discovered my car was missing the clutch return spring! Having put one on the clutch seems to make so much more sense.

But, sorry guys, one last question!! With the pedals now all reassembled and whatnot, the brake pedal seems to be WAY too far from the floor when at rest, seems like the spring is too short - it is never near relaxed. My thinking is that either the spring ESM sent IS too short, or I have put the spring on wrong.

Does the brake pedal return spring go from the clevis pin on the side of the brake pedal to a little mount inside the chassis leg? I couldn't find any pictures or diagrams of where it goes on the internet.

Many thanks again
1965 2Dr - She's called Lola


philthehill
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Re: Clutch Pedal through floor squeek, advice please

Postby philthehill » Sat Jun 14, 2014 10:38 pm

The brake pedal return spring (Pt No: AAA599) goes from the 2nd hole in the clevis pin (Pt No: AAA1486) to the bracket inside the chassis leg.
The yoke (Pt No: AAA414) is adjustable in relation to the push rod (Pt No: AAA413) and locked in place by lock nut (Pt No: AJD8205Z) so there is some adjustment of the pedal braking height. Make sure that there is sufficient thread contact between the yoke and push rod when adjusting the pedal height.



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