Uneven Tyre Wear??

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EYV65
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Uneven Tyre Wear??

Postby EYV65 » Wed May 15, 2019 5:46 pm

3 of our Minors have very bad wear to the inside of their tyres, they are as follows

1955 2 door saloon, standard, no rewelded chassis legs, both tyres wear the same on the inside
1965 pickup, slight modification having a 1275 engine, Not welded
1965 pickup with marina running gear, but no evidence of chassis welding

I have had them into National Tyres for the tracking to be looked at, but this seems folly as they say there is nothing wrong, but the wear is awful... hopefully a picture if showing? Image

Can anyone help with this please?
Attachments
P1030119.JPG
Tyres
P1030119.JPG (1.31 MiB) Viewed 466 times
Moggie Mad
1965 Original Pickup
1965 Pickup (Originally a Van)
1959 Van
1970 Van
1956 2 Door
1961 4 Door
1951 2 Door

philthehill
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Re: Uneven Tyre Wear??

Postby philthehill » Wed May 15, 2019 6:42 pm

What are they saying is correct?

The track should toe in by 3/32" or 2.5mm.

Incorrect camber can cause the same wear.

Camber is set at the factory but can be adjusted if required but requires a camber gauge.

Check the eye bolt bushes for serviceability and whilst you say that the chassis is ok I would still check the condition of the chassis leg in the area of the eyebolt.


oliver90owner
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Re: Uneven Tyre Wear??

Postby oliver90owner » Wed May 15, 2019 10:26 pm

They are idiots? If the racking is wearing the tyres, then it needs altering slightly to compensate for the obvious wear.

While one cannot continue to compensate for wear elsewhere in the linkages (and this should be checked and addressed), if it needs another mm then it needs another mm to provide even tyre wear.

I had a Peugeot 205 that was always tracked ‘correctly’ plus a quarter turn on the track rods. I monitor my tyre wear and adjust as necessary. Tyres are expensive, but adjusting the tracking is simple and costs nothing. I don’t wait until the tyres are wearing badly before making any slight adjustment necessary.

A different matter if the whole thing has been pulled apart for repairs. Then I go to my friendly tyre fitters for a quick check.

EYV65
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Re: Uneven Tyre Wear??

Postby EYV65 » Thu May 16, 2019 8:55 am

The issue we have is that that our pickups are our day use vehicle and as you correctly say, tyres are expensive, we have tried to address the issue so that new tyres do not get bad wear, but as you can see, after only a couple of months of use the tyre in the picture has been removed from our pickup and is badly worn!!

Due to this happening after spending a lot of 30 quids... which also gets expensive.. on tracking, and although certainly not a guru on Minors, we want to tackle this problem ourselves, but really need the "dummies" how to, A to Z guide on what to do. :o
Moggie Mad
1965 Original Pickup
1965 Pickup (Originally a Van)
1959 Van
1970 Van
1956 2 Door
1961 4 Door
1951 2 Door

EYV65
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Posts: 29
Joined: Thu May 12, 2016 11:56 pm
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Re: Uneven Tyre Wear??

Postby EYV65 » Thu May 16, 2019 8:57 am

philthehill wrote:
Wed May 15, 2019 6:42 pm
What are they saying is correct?

The track should toe in by 3/32" or 2.5mm.

Incorrect camber can cause the same wear.

Camber is set at the factory but can be adjusted if required but requires a camber gauge.

Check the eye bolt bushes for serviceability and whilst you say that the chassis is ok I would still check the condition of the chassis leg in the area of the eyebolt.
They say that the tracking is correct!

Will have to find out how to change the camber maybe, the chassis is good, although bushes may need to change!
Moggie Mad
1965 Original Pickup
1965 Pickup (Originally a Van)
1959 Van
1970 Van
1956 2 Door
1961 4 Door
1951 2 Door

Nickol
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Re: Uneven Tyre Wear??

Postby Nickol » Thu May 16, 2019 9:08 am

EYV65 wrote:
Thu May 16, 2019 8:55 am
The issue we have is that that our pickups are our day use vehicle and as you correctly say, tyres are expensive, we have tried to address the issue so that new tyres do not get bad wear, but as you can see, after only a couple of months of use the tyre in the picture has been removed from our pickup and is badly worn!!

Due to this happening after spending a lot of 30 quids... which also gets expensive.. on tracking, and although certainly not a guru on Minors, we want to tackle this problem ourselves, but really need the "dummies" how to, A to Z guide on what to do. :o
I have not tried this but it seems a good idea

https://youtu.be/AFD32Z-Wd1w
Gott schütze mich vorm Sturm und Wind und Autos, die aus England sind.
download/file.php?id=4822[/sig]

philthehill
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Re: Uneven Tyre Wear??

Postby philthehill » Thu May 16, 2019 11:10 am

I used to use a similar tracking gauge back in the seventies when checking and/or adjusting the tracking of Morris Minors and it did the job admirably.

The BMC wksp manual sets out the tracking procedure in detail.

If you do replace the eye bolt bushes - I would advise that you fit poly bushes - much better and longer lasting than the rubber type.

One of the biggest problems with modern garages is understanding that with the Minor being rear wheel drive the front wheels when driven are pushed wider at the front so the toe in becomes zero when driven. Most modern cars are front wheel drive which when driven pushes the front of the wheel inwards so the wheels are set to give toe out. When driven the driving action pushes the wheels to zero toe out.

Because of the above I would have asked them what specific measurements they set the toe in/out . If they set it to toe out that will give the wear that you have. There is correct and correct correct.

In lieu of purchasing the special tracking and camber gauges I would recommend that you take the vehicles to a garage that understands older cars and who will set the toe in to precisely 3/32".


simmitc
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Re: Uneven Tyre Wear??

Postby simmitc » Thu May 16, 2019 11:34 am

A lot of modern garages use "computer tracking" and guarantee to set the wheels parallel, which is correct for them. However, the Minor, as Phil notes, requires some toe-in. Without that, parallel = too much too-out, which produces wear on the inside of the tyre, which is what you have. Basic rule: inside wear = too much toe-out, increase the toe-in; outside wear = too much toe-in, increase the toe-out.

As Oliver90 sujggests, monitor the wear and make small adjustments to compensate. With both tyres wearing, it's best to adjust both sides equally in small measures rather than one large movement on one side. This helps to preserve the position of the steering wheel without then having to adjust the wheel-column-indicator setup.

The flat drive-over gauge works well on a smooth surface. The aim here is to achieve a reading of zero as the suspension is alredy under load as you drive forwards. to-in is required at reast so that as the car moves forwards, the wheels are forced backwads into a parallel track. Front wheel drive tends to need toe-out as the wheels pull forward to become parallel. The amount of toe-in/out required depends on many factor ssuch as design of suspension, components ised, type of bearings, size of wheels/tyres, drive train, weight, and so on.

When adjusting tracking, wire brish the threads and nut, and apply some releasing fluid a little while before you start. Use the correct sized spanner, and don;t be afraid to apply some force to release the lock nut. In stubborn cases, apply some heat, but to so much that you melt rubber components!

Edward1949
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Re: Uneven Tyre Wear??

Postby Edward1949 » Fri May 17, 2019 1:33 pm

simmitc wrote:
Thu May 16, 2019 11:34 am

The flat drive-over gauge works well on a smooth surface. The aim here is to achieve a reading of zero as the suspension is alredy under load as you drive forwards. to-in is required at reast so that as the car moves forwards, the wheels are forced backwads into a parallel track.
I bought one of these gauges recently, partly because I don't have much faith in my local alignment centre. I like the fact that instead of trying to measure accurately the distances between wheels it uses a completely different approach. It simply indicates whether the front wheels are "fighting" each other with excessive toe-in/out, or are running perfectly parallel.


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