Rear Suspension Overhaul Advice please

[paul 300358]

They were £350 last year.

[svenedin]

They were £350 last year.

Painful but quality costs money. If they last as long as my current springs did I will not be around to be buying another set!

How long did delivery take?

[neilmorey]

I fitted the ESM kit last year, bit of an issue fitting the pins to the spring hanger but otherwise more straightforward than expected.

Some photos in my post, last couple show position of axle stand with timber packer. I did one side at a time as all round access wasn't possible.

viewtopic.php?p=676280#p676280

[Grumpy21]

I fitted the ESM kit last year, bit of an issue fitting the pins to the spring hanger but otherwise more straightforward than expected.

Some photos in my post, last couple show position of axle stand with timber packer. I did one side at a time as all round access wasn't possible.

viewtopic.php?p=676280#p676280

The link explains the problem I had getting the pin to fit into the hole, I made comments there too.

[svenedin]

I fitted the ESM kit last year, bit of an issue fitting the pins to the spring hanger but otherwise more straightforward than expected.

Some photos in my post, last couple show position of axle stand with timber packer. I did one side at a time as all round access wasn't possible.

viewtopic.php?p=676280#p676280

The link explains the problem I had getting the pin to fit into the hole, I made comments there too.

Hmm. That would annoy me. Is there any reason why I can't reuse the old the old plate? It seems the old plate is made better.

[Grumpy21]

I found something odd. The ‘old’ plate had been manufactured in two pieces, a flat plat and a tubular section pressed together. The tubular section had worked loose on both sides and wasn’t locating the pin securely. The ‘new’ plate was a single piece pressing with the pin hole pressed through and so the pin didn’t fit correctly (as per the linked post). A quick wiz on my little lathe and a flash of emery cloth had them fitting perfectly.

Ps, I’d get that under seal brushed off before you start with the plus gas

[svenedin]

I found something odd. The ‘old’ plate had been manufactured in two pieces, a flat plat and a tubular section pressed together. The tubular section had worked loose on both sides and wasn’t locating the pin securely. The ‘new’ plate was a single piece pressing with the pin hole pressed through and so the pin didn’t fit correctly (as per the linked post). A quick wiz on my little lathe and a flash of emery cloth had them fitting perfectly.

Ps, I’d get that under seal brushed off before you start with the plus gas

I think I'll be test fitting that pin and plate without the spring present to check it is going to fit.

Yes, I'll brush off any underseal that is going to prevent the PlusGas from doing its job. In fact, I will brush off loose underseal and do some painting underneath (stone chip paint) wherever I can see rust. I also intend to replace the exhaust system in the same batch of jobs as the springs.

[paul 300358]

They were £350 last year.

Painful but quality costs money. If they last as long as my current springs did I will not be around to be buying another set!

How long did delivery take?

About a week

[svenedin]

They were £350 last year.

Painful but quality costs money. If they last as long as my current springs did I will not be around to be buying another set!

How long did delivery take?

About a week

That’s quick. Are you pleased with the quality, the fit and the way the suspension performs? It’s a lot more money than the ESM springs but I recall 30 years ago that the springs were expensive or at least I thought so then when I was a poor student. Of course I no longer have the bill but relatively speaking I am pretty sure they were more expensive than the ESM springs. At that time I had a mechanic friend who was very particular about the quality of parts. He had 2x concours Morris 8’s he’d rebuilt. He’d never have fitted cheap springs.

[svenedin]

I've ordered from Jones Springs of Walsall. British spring steel and springs made in Britain. Properly heat treated.

For 5 leaf springs (my car is a convertible) they are £130 + VAT each.

They are made to order and the company is extremely busy at the moment. Delivery 3-4 weeks.

If a job is worth doing.........I have no intention of doing the job again!

Many thanks for the warning about the quality of springs from the usual suppliers. I will keep the old springs as they may be able to be re-tempered (they were top quality when new).

Stephen

[olonas]

As far as I'm aware this is correct re the orientation, front/rear. They're starting to look a bit "flat".

spring.jpg (193.05 KiB) Viewed 56685 times

spring 2.jpg (165.04 KiB) Viewed 56685 times

[philthehill]

The above is correct
Two clamps to the front of the axle and one clamp to the rear of the axle.
I would advise that you fit poly bushes to the front and rear eyes.
You can fit poly spring seats for the axle but for a road vehicle it may be best to fit rubber spring seats but their life may not be as long as poly seats as quality does not seem to be good these days.
I always drill out the two 1/4" UNF front spring eye pin plate bolts to 5/16" as I find the next size up bolts easier to work with.
The front eye bolt spring should be a firm press fit into the plate.
I always enlarge the two pin spanner holes in the head of the front eye pin and use a pin spanner to hold the pin otherwise it is near impossible to hold the pin and stop it rotating when tightening the nut at the other end.

Eye pin 2.JPG (795.93 KiB) Viewed 56678 times

To make life even better as regards the pin, bush and plate I have done the following:
Shortened a J4 front suspension bush and machined the standard front eye pin.
Latterly machined a high tensile cap headed bolt which is then fitted with the head from a standard front eye pin.
With the J4 bush it will be a fit and forget exercise. The J4 bushes can be fitted to all suspension points.

rear spring plate..JPG (1.01 MiB) Viewed 56673 times

Rear spring front eye bushing..JPG (712.13 KiB) Viewed 56673 times

Rear spring front bush.JPG (978.98 KiB) Viewed 56673 times

[svenedin]

Thank you Phil. I was wondering about a pin spanner to hold the head of the pin still. I believe there are adjustable pin spanners available but the pin holes are rather small. I think one of my tools for opening watch backs with work fine.

Yes to poly bushes. Would the poly spring seats lead to a ride that is too harsh?

[philthehill]

The pin spanner pictured above is made from a small 4" dia grinder retaining nut spanner. One of the holes is slotted to accommodate any variance in distances between the holes in the pin.
Yes the holes in the eye pins are small and that is why I enlarge them to a standard size. Not all holes in the eye pin are the same dia or distance apart.
The suspension spring does not flex/move under or between the spring mount plates to any noticeable degree so the poly spring plate bushes should have little effect on the ride but gives a much improved axle location.

[svenedin]

My watch back opening tool. The spacing of the three points of contact is adjustable and the various heads are interchangeable. For this job only two pins needed. Considerable torque is needed to open a watch back so it should be study enough to hold the pin.

IMG_9108.jpeg (2.64 MiB) Viewed 56667 times

IMG_9107.jpeg (1.67 MiB) Viewed 56667 times

[paul 300358]

I've ordered from Jones Springs of Walsall. British spring steel and springs made in Britain. Properly heat treated.

For 5 leaf springs (my car is a convertible) they are £130 + VAT each.

They are made to order and the company is extremely busy at the moment. Delivery 3-4 weeks.

If a job is worth doing.........I have no intention of doing the job again!

Many thanks for the warning about the quality of springs from the usual suppliers. I will keep the old springs as they may be able to be re-tempered (they were top quality when new).

Stephen

Since fitting the jones springs, my car is far smoother over bumps and has yet to bottom out. They are a quality spring correctly made for the job.

[svenedin]

I've ordered from Jones Springs of Walsall. British spring steel and springs made in Britain. Properly heat treated.

For 5 leaf springs (my car is a convertible) they are £130 + VAT each.

They are made to order and the company is extremely busy at the moment. Delivery 3-4 weeks.

If a job is worth doing.........I have no intention of doing the job again!

Many thanks for the warning about the quality of springs from the usual suppliers. I will keep the old springs as they may be able to be re-tempered (they were top quality when new).

Stephen

Since fitting the jones springs, my car is far smoother over bumps and has yet to bottom out. They are a quality spring correctly made for the job.

Great to hear. I’ve ordered from Jones.

[kevin s]

I would fit superpro spring pads, I've used their bushes in other applications and you don't really see any noticible change in refinement. The rubber ones around now don't last, ours were cracked after 3 years sitting on axle stands.

[MikeNash]

Stephen,
Going back to advice on how to support the car, I saw this reading my Workshop Manual this eve (as yer do) that on page 3 of the "General Information" section there is the following

HOISTING THE CAR WITH A SLING
Either end of the car may be raised by a wire or rope passed below the two bumper bar brackets. It is advisable to place a piece of rag or suitable soft packing between the radiator grille and the sling for protection of the paintwork and plating.

This is accompanied by a photo of a Minor's front end raised off the ground. Has anyone tried this? How about giving it a go, Stephen?
Regards from MikeN.

[svenedin]

Stephen,
Going back to advice on how to support the car, I saw this reading my Workshop Manual this eve (as yer do) that on page 3 of the "General Information" section there is the following

HOISTING THE CAR WITH A SLING
Either end of the car may be raised by a wire or rope passed below the two bumper bar brackets. It is advisable to place a piece of rag or suitable soft packing between the radiator grille and the sling for protection of the paintwork and plating.

This is accompanied by a photo of a Minor's front end raised off the ground. Has anyone tried this? How about giving it a go, Stephen?
Regards from MikeN.

Thank you for your reply Mike.

I have a BMC workshop manual but my edition does not mention this. I am sure I have read about it being done in my reading over the years.

It would be a useful technique to avoid the clutter of axle stands to support the body. Unfortunately, I do not trust the roof beams in my garage to be able to support that much weight so I will not be able to try this.

Stephen