Advice please on brake upgrade

[morrisbetsy]

hi, i have finally decided to upgrade the original brake system on my 1971 morris 1000 as its used as my main car with children in. i wont be doing the work myself but have a mechanic willing to fit if i buy the parts.
can any one who has upgraded their cars brake system please advise me on options and costs? i've looked at esm website but there seems to be many options - unsure which option to take & what i actually need!
many thanks

thank you for the reply, i've been driving her for 18months with original brakes so not concerned with her 'feeling' like a modern car but i would like to reduce the time she takes to stop as i use dual carriageways most days. Was there a huge difference in breaking distance when you fitted the new disc brakes? in your opinion was it worth the expense as its quite a bit more than i had anticipated and i've got fitting costs on top of that!

[Alex'n'Ane]

The kits come with basically everything to get the kit fitted and working, some however are more reliable that others. It seems that this is the best disc brake kit on the market http://www.jlhmorrisminors.co.uk/store/ ... roductId=9 as some have had issues with the hubs on the other http://morrisminorspares.co.uk/shop/pro ... 4ed79fa03b Ford rather than marina is probably a more sensible option if buying new as replacement parts will be a lot easier to get in future. Keep with minor pcd as this will mena you can use your existing wheels. A brake servo http://morrisminorspares.co.uk/shop/pro ... ce879d7585 might also be sensible if your used to driving a modern car as some find the pedal can be hard to push. A remote fluid reservoir will sometimes also be required, but i believe not essential. It is also required to alter the master cylinder slightly by removing the top hat seal (see other threads on here) or you can purchase a brand new master cylinder with this already removed from Jlh minors (see top link). I'm sure there is something i have missed. Some people may say that discs are not necessary, but having recently fitted discs and a servo i would not go back.

[dellerie]

having fitted disc brakes within the last 6 weeks, i'd never drive with drum brakes again. i have purchased a new servo for fitment later. i don't think the disc brakes really need a servo, but i shall fit it so the wife can drive the car.

[bmcecosse]

The easiest/least expensive upgrade is to fit the 9" front drums from a Wolseley 1500. Excellent brakes and light pedal - no mods to master cylinder, no servo required, no remote reservoir either - and I can't make mine fade no matter how hard I try. The difficult part is finding a set.......

[TomLS]

I've just got a servo on my Traveller, and the same 8" drums you should have on the front, it being a later model. The only benefit I can see with discs is the lack of fade. If I push the pedal half as hard as I can its very easy to lock up all 4 wheels, so the stopping power of the drums is more than adequate. However on long / steep descents it is necessary to shift to 2nd or 3rd which can be very loud, as after 10 seconds or so of braking they start to smell very hot!

Having done a lot of research into disc brakes (mainly just for interest as it'll be a while before I have a spare £500 kicking around!) and I would concur that the JLH Ford brake kit gets the best reviews. I have 2 other vehicles on solid front discs, both of which I've driven hard and both of which weigh more than the Minor, and I've never managed to fade them!

[mike.perry]

The simplest upgrade is to fit Wolseley 1500 9inch front drums. The back plates are a straight swop and just need a slight modification to the slots to fit the Minor wheel cylinders, or you can use the Wolseley cylinders but replacements are harder to find. You will also need a new wheel cylinder connecting pipe
The only problem is that they are getting difficult to find

[bmcecosse]

The wheel cylinder pipe from 8" brakes fits just fine...

[faversham999]

would Marina front Drums and back plates be any good

[mike.perry]

Marina has wrong PCD

[bmcecosse]

Unlikely to be 'bolt on' conversion - but indeed, anything is possible - but are they bigger than 8" diameter ?

[dellerie]

who wants to keep on adjusting silly cylinders that end up leaking and seizing if they are used often enough? nah.... not me.

disc are fit and forget until its time to change the pads. just keep your eye on the fluid level though......

[bmcecosse]

I never have to adjust my Wolseley front brakes - the wear rate seems to be amazingly low. But I do agree - if planning doing high mileage discs are probably the best way to go - but they are expensive.....maybe ~ £600 all told, and then quite complicated fitting, including master cylinder removal/refitting. My W brakes cost me £60 - although these days it's fair to say £120/150 is more likely. Still a LOT less than discs! And less than 1 hour per side to fit them.........

[M25VAN]

£600 maybe, maybe not. £299+vat for a Marina based kit from ESM. All brand new, no exchange parts and off the shelf. No need to wait for a set to come up on ebay, although they do from time time and obviously a lot cheaper.
It's all I run and have done for a long time before anyone mentions Servo's and remote resevoir's.

[bmcecosse]

I suspect the ESM disc brakes use the alloy hub - which has not been noted for it's longevity! Carry on at your risk - then you need the servo, the remote reservoir -and the new modified master cylinder! Actually - I doubt £600 will cover it!!!!!!!!!!!

[MarkyB]

Longevity is always going to be a tricky one, callipers do seem to need less maintenance than cylinders.
The really tough question is, how long will spares be available for?
We are already seeing 20/50 oil becoming less common, which brake set-up will they stop making parts for first?

[bmcecosse]

It's the alloy hubs that are the possible problem area.... the kits with steel hubs are quite a bit more expensive - but I reckon you gets what you pays for...... I dare say discs, pads and bearings will 'always' be available. TR7 rear brake shoes are easily adaptable to the W brakes (and shoes can be relined ad infinitum) - as are Minor wheel cylinders. Drums I suppose could become a problem - in about 1000 years judging from the absolutely insignificant wear on mine to date - presumably after a hard first life on a W 1500 !

[Alex'n'Ane]

I suspect the ESM disc brakes use the alloy hub - which has not been noted for it's longevity! Carry on at your risk - then you need the servo, the remote reservoir -and the new modified master cylinder! Actually - I doubt £600 will cover it!!!!!!!!!!!

Having done this marina conversion only a couple of weeks ago, I can say that I fitted a new mc all new brake lines remote reservoir and the marina disc kit and servo (both second hand) for £320 If buying new you could add another £230 to that price, but imo the servo is not necessary, so -£80. So i agree the £500 is nearer to the mark, but that is doing all the work myself, so not cheap. I also don't think any of the marina conversions have the alloy hubs! I'm almost certain thats only the 1 ford disc kit.

[M25VAN]

I suspect the ESM disc brakes use the alloy hub

Why?, they are steel........

Carry on at your risk

then you need the servo, the remote reservoir

No you don't but the Remote resevoir does make topping up easier....

and the new modified master cylinder!

or you could modify your existing one

I doubt £600 will cover it!!!!!!!!!!!

I guess not if you were doing the upgrade.

By the way BMC, what other cars do the Wolseley drums fit? I see that EBC and Brembo do quite alot of drums for older cars....

[bmcecosse]

Point taken re alloy hubs etc -I'm no expert on the discs since my car is on drums. As long as steel hubs - then the kit should be fine for reliability. W drums - won't fit anything else - nothing else has 4" PCD..

[morrisbetsy]

£600 maybe, maybe not. £299+vat for a Marina based kit from ESM. All brand new, no exchange parts and off the shelf. No need to wait for a set to come up on ebay, although they do from time time and obviously a lot cheaper.
It's all I run and have done for a long time before anyone mentions Servo's and remote resevoir's.

£299 plus vat...thats £360 plus fitting at £180 as quoted by mechanic...not far off that £600 unless you can fit it yourself